795 posts in this topic

I still need to see a cut-away or whatever of the EGR valve-Iain

If you're anywhere near London give me a shout. I've got one sitting in the garage....

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Well I will be headed in on Oct 3 for my second EGR valve. First one changed at 16892 km's (part# 0019890v002000000). At 23053 kms they changed an air intake line and seal part# 0003017v004000000. I now have 28000kms and have been waiting for over 3 weeks to get my car in for repair. They say they are real busy. In my opinion it is somewhat dangerous to drive the car in this condition. Acceleration is very poor if not flat. Maybe Transport Canada should be made aware of this issue to envoke some sort of safety recall. The dealership says that there is now an updated EGR valve and that my first warranty claim was serviced with the original style EGR valve that was troublesome. I also enquired about using Stanadyne or other additives to help aid the clogging issue and I was told that under no circumstances should diesel fuel additive be used and that such use would void my warranty. I always fuel up at the Flying J which is Shell diesel. I am sure I will be also looking for a detailed "How To" service the EGR valve when the next one needs to be changed off warranty.Patrick

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I think i'm going to have to take my car in to have the EGR valve serviced. Acceleration in my car has gone from "sluggish" to "dangerously sluggish". In 2nd and 3rd gear, i should be able to get that "push you back in your seat" amount of thrust, but i'm not getting it any more. Even running the car up to 4,000 RPM, i'm still got getting decent acceleration.The car is pushing 60,000 km, so i'm sure it's about time, even though it gets a diet of Sunoco Gold almost exclusively.

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Cleaned out my EGR valve mixing chamber again this weekend, additives have been helping, as does my higher speeds now but not a whole lot. Lower 1/3 of the chamber was pretty grungy but I got it all cleaned out down to the bottom ports. Upon restart the car was angry like it always is as I think it tries to adapt and threw the PO401 code at me again and an engine light, but these always disappear again with time.

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Is the cleaning procedure well documented (with photos) somewhere? Did you clean it in situ or remove it first?

Edited by Mike T

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Dont think its been "really" documented.. and I always do it in place....... its just a matter of removing all of the deposits from the mixing chamber to clear two small ports on either side at the bottom..... I dont think anyone has a decent picture of the internals as yet.....

Edited by mixed

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OK thanks, so you just remove the top to gain access, or ....?

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Unclogging arteries,Has anyone replaced their TIK pipes with the smooth Mocal Silicone versions?I suspect that in conjunction with a free flowing air filter, that the intake side of the motor will breath easier, lessening the load on the EGR, regardless of driving style.I can't fathom how the stock TIK air pipe with the turbulance on the inner walls coupled with a restrictivepaper air filter could deliver a clean and constant air flow. But, then again, maybe I am a simple bugger and my understanding of basic air flow physics do not translate to smart engines. Also, at minus 20C or colder, before proper engine heat up, that recirculating vapor must get pretty gummy.Has there been any tracking done with respect to vehicle location in Canada and EGR failure? After the pics you guys put up on the site, I am going to do the cleaning, I have 18 000 Kms on the car so I am really curious.

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B Tisshaw,The mocal TIK pipes do not fit the CDi. I pulled out the airbox and made a nice, smooth long-radius 90* from the airbox end of the oem air hose and then a clean increaser to an Amsoil "nano-fibre" induction filter. It's a very sweet intake setup.The smart's oem paper filter is actually pretty good when it's new and spanky clean. Just replace it often for peak performance. There is actually more to be gained on the exhaust side of the pump, though it's more expensive.And yes, the CCV vapour is grossly gummy at colder temperatures, and is responsible for much that goes wrong on the intake side, from the turbo right down the line...FWIW,Bil B)

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Bil...thanks for the heads up, I will not order rubber bits for the smart which...uhmm... don't fit! I did install a Jetex Sports Performance cotton gauze air filter. Washable, 99% efficiency @ 2,8 microns,so I am really happy with the modest increase in breathing, but only a higher RPM's nothing under 2500.Perhaps a smooth flow intake set up like yours is in the future.Mike, sorry if my comment was misleading, I meant the pictures of the sludge filled EGR at the start of the postare motivating me to do the cleaning. I have not seen step by step pix of the R & R procedure despite much searching.I am going to ask "how to" to the best smart tech in Montreal @ MB West Island, the good Dr. Serban. (The same mechanic who installed the Bilstein suspension on my smart, and has give me countless invaluable tech tips)If I can get you any insight on the how to, before you tackle the egr cleaning, I will be sure to post.

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That would be appreciated. I don't mind spending 4 hours under a car in the summer, but right now I'd rather cut to the chase!

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Is the cleaning procedure well documented (with photos) somewhere? Did you clean it in situ or remove it first?

I just cleaned out the EGR from a smart with 90,580 kms- mostly highway- had buildup, but not too bad.

Pretty simple to do. Looseed the clamp, cut 1 tie strap, and then worked on getting the hose off. I used a small pick, brush, rags, and Milligans bio penetrating oil to do the job. Total time about 1 hour.

Pictures

1. look at lower part of the chamber

2. job done- clean

3. conduit on hose leaves an imprint

4. piece of carpet placed between hose and conduit to prevent air leak.

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Thanks for the photos! If the dealer does nothing for free to my car, I will be in there on my own car soon.

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Wonderful, Glenn! Very much appreciate the illustrated guide. Another quick and "easy" periodic maintenance item. Have to check mine this summer as a proactive routine.

Difficulty Rating: ... maybe... 2 out of 5 band-aids?

Bil :sun:

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Perfect timing. I'll add this to my next service. almost at 51K now.It sure makes a nice round hole through all that junk.

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Had my wifes smart in at three point motors in Nanaimo today because of the check engine light being on. Turned out to be a bad injector. I questioned the mechanic about the EGR valve problem and he agreed they replaced a lot of them. I asked when they had to replace ours if I could have the old one but he said they have to send them back to the factory. He also said fuel additives, highway driving and the higher cost fuel dosent seem to help. He agrees with many on the forum that the main cause is our poor grade of fuel in Canada and he see's most of the problems after 75000 klm. He also agreed with me about cleaning them ourselves and that it wasnt to hard a job to do. I think they replace them with a new one because of the warrenty issue but I got from him that all they need is a good cleaning. I believe the part is about 400 bucks? I will be cleaning mine.

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Earlier in the thread there was discussion about disabling the EGR valve by use of a blocking plate.Another commented that removing the wiring harness would put the car into permanent limp mode.Might it be possible to simulate the EGR valve by connecting some type of resistive element to the EGR harness so that the EGR valve is disabled, but the electronics are tricked into thinking that it's still present?

Edited by smartdriver

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Earlier in the thread there was discussion about disabling the EGR valve by use of a blocking plate.Another commented that removing the wiring harness would put the car into permanent limp mode.Might it be possible to simulate the EGR valve by connecting some type of resistive element to the EGR harness so that the EGR valve is disabled, but the electronics are tricked into thinking that it's still present?

You don't have to do that. Install the plate and leave the electrical plugged in. The valve will still open and close as instructed by the EDG/ECU but there is simply no exhaust gas passing through it. It won't induce a protective mode because the feedback loop "thinks" that everything is working normally. Because it is. ;)HTHBil :sun:

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Where does the plate go, Bil? Is it something you manufactured yourself? How does it work? Are there any drawbacks?-Iain

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You don't have to do that. Install the plate and leave the electrical plugged in. The valve will still open and close as instructed by the EDG/ECU but there is simply no exhaust gas passing through it. It won't induce a protective mode because the feedback loop "thinks" that everything is working normally. Because it is. ;)HTHBil :sun:

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The plate goes between the EGR mix valve housing and the recirculating gas pipe, where the pipe enters the mix housing.

The plate is purpose-made for the smart CDi. PM for the source if you want one.

So where does the goop go? The return pipe is now closed. Exhaust gas pressure will just force all the products of combustion out the down-pipe and through the exhaust canister. There will be less goop condensed because the EGT is higher. The Cat' will work better too - same reason.

I read from the maker of this punch-cut plate that there is no measurable difference in emissions at the tailpipe. And that he used this "stealth" device (if you can call it that) for over 150,000 Km in his fortwo CDi in Europe with no deleterious effects.

I'll tell ya: I am sold on it and want to install it as soon as I get settled in my new place and find a place to work on m'wee smartie!

...... Posted Image

Bil :sun:

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You don't have to do that. Install the plate and leave the electrical plugged in. The valve will still open and close as instructed by the EDG/ECU but there is simply no exhaust gas passing through it. It won't induce a protective mode because the feedback loop "thinks" that everything is working normally. Because it is. ;)HTHBil :sun:

What if I don't have a blocking plate?I found some information for an electronic fix which I thought some might find interesting, but I am unable to include a link in my reply without getting an error message.A Google search for EGR FIX will find it.

Temporary EGR fixActually it's not a fix, it's just a way to be able to drive without a functioning EGR. Sometimes the EGR gets stuck or one of the related components fail and the ECU decides that you should limp home. This will happen at a moment you really need your car...Before going on:Driving without a functioning EGR will increase the NOx output, which is an environment issue. In some countries this may be illegal. So before you decide to use this fix, check if you legally can do so.How is it connectedThe output wire of the MAF (pin 5 of Bosch MAF and pin 6 of Pierburg MAF) is cut and the circuit below is inserted. The wire coming from the MAF connects to the wire with label 'MAF Output' and the wire that goes to the ECU is connected to the wire 'To ECU'. The supply voltages of this circuit are taken from the MAF connector too. It only draws a current of a few mA. One more wire is connected to the EGR. Wire colors may differ, but it mostly is red/yellow. The other wire (black/yellow) of the EGR is connected to the infamous relay 109, it's the 12V supply. This circuit doesn't need this black/yellow wire. The flip switch X1 is set to the upper position to enable the circuit. If the circuit is enabled, the EGR valve should stay closed. If it is stuck open, close it by hand and plug the vacuum hose so it doesn't open again. Do not disconnect the EGR wires, the ECU will again force limp mode. If the EGR coil is burned, connect a 100 ohm 2W resistor across the EGR wires. The lower switch position is used to return to normal operation.How does it workBasically this circuit modulates the MAF output voltage dependent on the duty cycle of the EGR valve. With a working EGR valve, the MAF output voltage is modulated too, but only because the airflow through the MAF is really lowered if the EGR duty-cycle is increased. This circuit doesn't change the actual airflow, but it changes the airflow value that is reported to the ECU.First the MAF output voltage is buffered by transistors tn_1 and tp_1. The emitter voltage of tp_1 is equal to the MAF output voltage. This is needed as the MAF doesn't seem to allow much load on it's output. The new MAF output voltage is connected to the ECU via r_6. This voltage can be lowered by drawing some current through r_6. This current simulates the opening of the EGR valve. The EGR duty-cycle is converted to a voltage by r_14, r_15 and c_2. The voltage across c_2 equals Battery_voltage*EGR_duty/2. (The divide by 2 is needed for circuit reasons.) This EGR duty_cycle value is converted to a current by tp_4 and r_11. The current is 'mirrored' by tn_2 and tn_3 (r_12 and r_13 are added for increased accuracy) such that the collector current of tn_3 is equal to the collector current of tp_4, only the direction is inverted. Now the signal going to the ECU is modulated by the tn_3 collector current, which is dependent on the EGR duty-cycle.

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Edited by smartdriver

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