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a2jack

Transmission from Hell.

40 posts in this topic

"It's a manual transmission, with a motor that changes gears, and a second motor that opens/closes the clutch. END! Why must people over-complicate everything? "-Iain______________________________________________________________________________________Thank you 'Duck'In one sentence you spoke volumes. Read, Reread and read again the above. Until you understand it, don't post with 'answers?', post only,if you must, with questions .Start With:A. A CONVENTIONAL single plate clutchB. A MANUALLY SHIFTED transmissiom If you don't thoroughly understand the above, do not proceed until you do.A1. Substitute a 'hydraulic' linkage for the 'mechanical' to engage and release the clutch. ie: master and slave clylinders as used in braking systems. (still foot operated pedal inside the car)A2. Substitute an electric motor for the hydraulic or mechanical systems. (No clutch pedal) If you don't thoroughly understand the above, do not proceed until you doSMART Car uses A2Then:B1. A manually shifted by driver, transmission.B2. substitute an electric motor for the driver's action to change gears.Smart Car uses B2 If you don't thoroughly understand the above, do not proceed until you doC1. Add the ability to the computer to decide (dependant on data input: speed,load,rpm, etc,etc) when to shift (up or down). This computer ability is turned on or off via the little button on the left side of shift knob.Smart Car uses A2 and B2 and C!. If you don't thoroughly understand the above, do not proceed until you doIf you have a question, PM me. If necessary I will provide my phone numberThorough understanding of the above enables one to feel in control, not controled, My Smart and I are 'ONE'. Only through this understanding do I owe the compliment from the "Tech" at Smart House that he had not witnessed a Smart car driven with verve (Up&Down shift) that smoothly and fast. BTW: Several cars had setup variants of the above:Renault (Optional) Dauphine, R10, Caravalle (Minus the computer the R10 was like the Smart car, The clutch,in this case, was vacuum operated, shifting was electric). The first time I drove one I nearly wet my pants with laughter. I put it in drive and floored it,held it there, it zoomed (Zoomed ?) in first and just like a little man was in the back, he released the clutch and released the accelerator, shifted to the next higher gear, engaged the clutch and resumed to my floored postion of the accelerator. What a kick ! !Comments ?Donald LaFavor

You guys are just too funny!I’ve never seen anyone get so riled up over the semantics of an automatic transmission. You can talk till you’re blue in the face and it’s not going to change a thing.You know why?Because you have to leave your mechanic interpretation of an automatic transmission in your pocket and look through the eyes of the average consumer, not a mechanic.All they’re going to care is: “…am I going to have to shift or does the car do it by itself?”In their eyes, if the car does it by itself… it’s an automatic. If they have to shift, it’s a manual. It’s that simple. This car is unique because you can do both. The driver has that option. All the workings inside the transmission are irrelevant because the “average” person won’t care. A CVT may not be a “true” automatic either because it doesn’t have a torque converter. However, if I don’t have to “shift”, I’ll call it an automatic. I am not limiting my automatic transmission definition back to the 1950’s, 1960’s, and 1970’s. Today and future cars are changing the paradigm on what an automatic transmission is. Electric cars, CVT’s, Smart… all the public is going to care is whether they are going to have to shift, not how the transmission works.

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LorbeerTLC, well spoken.My sister is exactly what you would call an average consumer. She cannot drive a standard, so what does she ask me when I told her about the smart I was getting............Do you have to shift it? I said no, you don't have to. Her reply is......so it's an automatic, that's all I wanted to know. I can drive one.As you said, she doesn't care whether it is an automated manual or a regular automatic. Just so she doesn't have to shift it.

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Wheels - I clapped out loud at your post. That was AWESOME. :)LorBeerTLC - I'm fighting very hard not to flame you so bad.-Iain

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Come on Iain, give him a break. Some people like to know how things work, others just like to know that things work.I have enjoyed reading both viewpoints on this.(and I do understand the difference, and have thought if only there was some feasible way of modifying my wife's manual 5 speed Echo to have paddle shifters ... maybe using the Lego MindStorm, and some air powered cylinders to operate the clutch and shift lever ...)MG

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I am waiting for the first smart owner who puts his/her car in "P" to get the mail, and is surprised when it rolls away and crashes through a store window, because it's not a slushbox!When I test drive a CDN 451, I am gonna try this, just for laughs.

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Do we know what happens functionally to the gearbox when it's put in P?-Iain

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Do we know what happens functionally to the gearbox when it's put in P? -Iain

That's the $64,000 question!I will be shocked if the transmission is not locked when in the "P" - Park position just as all automatics are. If not, MB is in for a lot of trouble and potential litigation.

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I will see if I can find out - TPM has a couple of new cars - and a ramp in the parking lot!Cheers,Cameron

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The sales guy at TPM said the wheels are locked (ABS maybe) when the car is placed into "P".

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I just don't see how though, since the brakes are mechanically actuated/spring open. The brake servo would have to be running or something.Probably just transparently shifts into the highest ratio gear (1), and closes the clutch, to simulate, since compression resistance would be maximised.-Iain

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I mean when the engine is running and the car is in P, like the hill holder the older model has.When the engine is off, the clutch closes and the brakes are released. My speculation.....

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I mean when the engine is running and the car is in P, like the hill holder the older model has.When the engine is off, the clutch closes and the brakes are released. My speculation.....

Mike,I have a theory:What if putting it into "Park" places the transmission in Neutral and a Pawl locks the transaxle instead of the transmission?That way, you have a closed clutch/pressure plate (saving wear & tear on the springs), you can start it in "Park" and yet the vehicle remains "locked" in the drivetrain.-Tom L.

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Springs don't wear out if they're staying in one state - they wear out only with movement.I don't think there is a pawl (unless the Euro cars have it) - I doubt the transmission would be re-engineered like that just for the NA market.-Iain

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It's just a guess.I didn't think Europe had this transmission (?). I heard this was developed exclusively for the North American market.When you think about it, car rocks when placed in "Park", yet you can still start it in "Park", a transaxle lock seems feasible while the transmission is placed in neutral.We'll eventually find out how this works.

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I am expecting a blue silver passion coupe with leather, fogs and pods to be into Richmond this week... or early next. It could be in my driveway, but we'll see.

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