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Postman

The Future Of Csc

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Why? Well, the subject came up in another topic ("Let's all Google...") where it was way off topic. And s_mack said: "I find the idea of an "american" smart forum a bit odd... what does nationality have to do with it?"

Well, think about it. When smarts first started to be sold in Canada, were we [you original members] content with say, one of the British (UK) sites for smarts? No! A new site was started, ostensibly about all smarts, but in reality, for Canadian distributed smart cars. My guess (and its only a guess) is that the majority of the CsC members are Canadians. So when smarts are available in the U.S., do you imagine that Americans will be content with joining CsC?

I mean no disrespect to our American members. But seriously folks, do you really think Americans are going to be content with kilometers, Celsius or even daytime running lights, among the other requirements of Transport Canada? The chat sites of 10 years ago were the same. Is everyone willing to convert to Americanisms? Because the vast majority of 300 million Americans are not willing to be bothered with anything un-American. And America is big enough that they don't have to. I agree that we have no desire to be exclusively Canadian; we accept everyone. But our site is distinctively Canadian, and for Canadians that has a nice feel. And I must admit to a bit of smugness when I tell people that you can't even buy a smart in the States (yet).

What's my point?

I guess I just wanted to respond to s_mack's comment, in an appropriate topic, that apparently nationality does have something to do with it. And to suggest that as various members including the BOD consider restructuring the forums (e.g. Regional, or 450 vs. 451 models), we keep in mind that when smarts reach a critical mass in U.S. sales, our site will become a small fish in a very large North American pond. There's nothing wrong with that. But change does annoy some people, and even alienates some, and we need to decide how or whether we want to tackle that challenge.

I don't have a solution. Perhaps there isn't even a problem. But I've read at least one post discuss how to set up the Regional Forum for the U.S.A., and I think that whole topic needs a re-think. U.S.A. smarts are not a ripple, they are a tidal wave.

Note: Forgive me (a relatively new member) for using the collective word "we", if you feel that I have not yet 'paid my dues'.

Comments, anyone?

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Welcome to smartcarofamerica.com. smartusa.com will also be starting up a forum as well next year.Sorry, too much talk about cars in the snow, beer and bacon for many American's. Just as the German site doesn't work for us here in the USA (must be the language). And the UK site has the steering wheel on the wrong side. There are differences between our smarts and yours. Been glad to see your experiences. Now on with more discussion!

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The smart IS an international experience. I enjoy, and will always enjoy my visits to your forum as well as the one in the U.S. Both bring value, enjoyment, knowledge, and fun to owning or dreaming of a smart.

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It could happen in time. But I will say this as a yank that I have no problem with anything Canadian be it metric or whatever. It's a car site primarily. One other thing. The American site would have to be pretty damn good and not some knock off to give this (Csc) a run for the money. The UK sites were always foreign to me. I can log on (to Csc) anytime and find some criticism of the US. It doesn't bother me. I always recommend Canada to any of my turncoat countrymen. And about metrics. I saw some pages in my granddaughters math book (3rd. grade) and it was all about metrics. I wanted to rip them out so that her young mind would not be defiled but, thankfully) I came to my senses

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I am going to be honest and say that it does not really matter to me what nationality the site is. I think that is one of the main benefits of the internet in general. You can go anywhere in a matter of seconds to get the information you desire. Clubsmartcar was the first site I found when I purchased my smart however it is not the only one I utilize. I l whole-heartedly had the intent of not changing anything about the car when I bought it and letting it grow in value over time as an original. Then I found clubsmartcar and learned about all the cool things one could do with this car. The changes definitely took place and I don't regret them in the least. Thanks clubsmartcar!I also spend time on smartmaniacs, onsmart, smartz, etc. This is due to the fact that I am enjoying tuning this car to it's max potential and a site full of smart cdi owners was not as helpful for me. On these european sites I can learn many other options for tuning the petrol engine and have found other resources for obtaining the parts I need (can't wait for that roadster turbo and janspeed exhaust in the next few weeks!!) For me, it is not where the site evolved or who it's primary demographic is, it is which one provides the valuable information or interesting tidbits that I look for. In addition, I own a generation 450 and plan on it being my only one for a long, long time. I like the fact that they are in limited numbers here in the US and that gives it something the generation 451 will never have. I can't believe how the questions have gone from "what is it" to "how did you get yours already?" I seriously don't think the US Smart sites are going to be designed to benefit me however at this time the Canadian and European ones do. Who knows what this leads for the future though after the 451 has been around for a few years. I am more worried about where will I find technical information and good discussion about the 450 than where the site is located.Well - that's my two cents! I am interested to hear others.Todd

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American sites will start but it takes a rich content to keep people coming back. I went to the UK site for some time before it closed down. That was what really drove me to the Canadian sites. Also the Cdn sites were getting relevant content to my interests.

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I lean heavily on my Canadian friends up north, for any information on the smart fortwo. The Canadians have been wonderful providing volumes of news on the 451 and 450's. In fact, it was because of this site that I took the plunge in putting a down payment on a new 451. I enjoy the exchange of information. I know the States can be demanding and politics can strain our friendship. Sometimes power can corrupt the best of intentions and cloud judgment.I would be sadden if this site should divide itself between the Canadians and U.S. If Smart does become a hit in the U.S. and many yanks do sign-up on this site, as a suggestion, maybe we could call it "Club Smart Car of North America" (?) However, I respect the pride in Canadians and if majority wishes to keep it Canadian, so be it. I can completely understand and will respect whatever the administrators and Steven Mack decides.-Tom L.PS: In-so-far as the metric system, the U.S. should of changed over to metric in 1970, as per our original agreement. :)

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For me, Clubsmartcar.com is exactly what the name implies and our byline spells out: "for everyone who loves smart cars".This club happened to start in Canada, but it embraces anyone who cares to be a part of it---from anywhere in the world. I would like to think that most American buyers would feel comfortable in a club that also included members from other countries, and that seems to be the case with our many American members so far. There will always be a few 'Us and Them' people in any country (including Canada) who prefer to build walls rather than bridges---and those people will find their own clubs where they will not feel threatened. As smart sales accelerate in North America, I fully expect that the majority of our members will soon reside south of the 49th parallel.The previous generation smart available in North America had a few distinctly Canadian features , but the current generation will be pretty much common to everyone, so technical discussions about it should be applicable to all.As far as the metric system goes, I think it's only a matter of time until the U.S. joins the rest of the world---so an occasional brush with it is not a bad thing. Most Canadian members grew up non-metric, so are comfortable talking about both measurements. For the few times when this is an issue, we can simply have an on-site conversion spot to click on----it need not be an obstacle for 'smart' people to deal with, and certainly not a barrier to discussions.

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As a Canadian 451 owner and a new member, I think that the site has already been Americanized. Today's home page has six articles, ALL from a US perspective : Mississipi's Clarion Ledger, Indianapolis Auto Show, SearchChicago, NY Post, freepress.com, forbes.comThey're great articles, if you're American. For me though, I'll be looking to join (or establish) a site that is more focused on Canadian issues like ice locking up our brakes after car washes, winter tyre pressure monitors having to be fine tuned for cold weather, reports on Mercedes dealerships, PetroCanada car washes etc. There are and always will be things that we will find interesting on American sites and that Americans will come to our sites for and that's cool, but to have ALL six major stories refering to the fact that the smart is coming to town turns me off. Once you dig past the home page, you see that it really does have a lot of Canadian content. In general it's a fantastic site, well done to everyone involved, you all affected my decision to buy.As you can see, I agree with Postman that nationality does have something to do with it, but it may be too late for this site. Clubsmartcar.ca has been re-directed to clubsmartcar.com for too long and you can't undo it easily. There may be a way to create a new clubsmartcar.ca and moderate it in such a way as to redirect American traffic to clubsmartcar.com, I'm not sure. Clubsmartcar.ca would also need a slightly different identity/logo just so that members easily know which site they're on, which dollar we're talking about, kilometres, liters, celsius etc.Finally, given that the car is built in France and every fourth Canadian is French speaking, where is the French version of clubsmartcar.ca? or am I too Canadian?

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.....where is the French version of clubsmartcar.ca?

Club smart QuébecOther sites will come and prosper, there will be more than enough owners to go around. I participate in German and French smart forums and they don't seem to mind having foreigners there. And so it is here.I think the goal here is to have the biggest and best North American forum.The press info page is rubbish, I agree, we need some better stuff to show up on our homepage. Edited by Mike T

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My guess (and its only a guess) is that the majority of the CsC members are Canadians. So when smarts are available in the U.S., do you imagine that Americans will be content with joining CsC?

I am a very new member to this forum BUT I would not be in favor of a USA forum only. I lke the addiditon of the USA section but I have gathered more informaion form experienced drivers/owners than a stand alone USA site could render.

Just my view.

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For me, Clubsmartcar.com is exactly what the name implies and our byline spells out: "for everyone who loves smart cars".This club happened to start in Canada, but it embraces anyone who cares to be a part of it---from anywhere in the world. I would like to think that most American buyers would feel comfortable in a club that also included members from other countries, and that seems to be the case with our many American members so far. There will always be a few 'Us and Them' people in any country (including Canada) who prefer to build walls rather than bridges---and those people will find their own clubs where they will not feel threatened. As smart sales accelerate in North America, I fully expect that the majority of our members will soon reside south of the 49th parallel.The previous generation smart available in North America had a few distinctly Canadian features , but the current generation will be pretty much common to everyone, so technical discussions about it should be applicable to all.

Well said Deezle. Most original members here spent a lot of time on forums originating in Europe before getting their cars and some continue to visit those sites now. I believe what made Csc a necessity (at first) was the diesel engine we have and the inexperience at the dealerships about our cars in the first year they were available here. With that said I thought that Csc was a place for smart owners and enthusiasts to visit and share info and thoughts. Why is anyone worried about other clubs or feeling threatened. IT IS NOT A COMPETITION!

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Fate of CsC ?CsC will grow in membership as the NA 451s are delivered in the US. Many of the new members will be from border states, people who have long shared the climate and much of the culture of Canada. The "other club", SCOA, is based in LA and is growing more and more commercial each day. I foresee an exodus of members coming soon. Where will they go? Here, CsC, if this great club is ready to accommodate them. CsC can become the best and biggest source of Smart Information in the world. Think international, not in the narrow terms of a US invasion. We know and agree Bush, has really hurt our Image. But now the Canadians have Harper (Same mind set, different head). Lets not allow these creeps to affect how we interact with each other. Let's become Smart united. :) A2Jack.

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For one, I agree with much of what 42Kruiser's had to say. I also believe if CsC members continue to openly bash the North American concept, it will drive new US members away. But maybe some want it that way. Why do things have to come down to "Us v. Them"? Thankfully, I wasn't raised to think that way so whenever the topic comes us -- be it about race, sexual preference, nationality, etc, I'm always confused by it.Someone said here, "This club happened to start in Canada, but it embraces anyone who cares to be a part of it---from anywhere in the world." This sentiment seems true but only to a point. I don't want to Americanize CsC but it would be great if it embraced both models within North America. The problem is, there are some Cdns who want to maintain the Cdn identity (and I understand why). Maybe it was a mistake for CsC to incorporate the US. Maybe this issue should be addressed by the BoD. It's not too late to revert back to a Cdn site especially since smartUSA plans to open it's own fan site and new USA sites are popping up all around us. I would hate for CsC to revert back to a Cdn site but I would respect that decision.For me, I like to think of the CsC smart village with a trekky point of view. We gain smart information from others and share what we know while loving this little car. I think CsC is still experiencing an "identity crisis". It's either a club "For Everyone Who Loves Smart Cars" or a club "For Canadians who love smart cars". Thank goodness the acronym can accommodate either logo but it needs to quickly decide what it is (once and for all).My two American cents,Regina

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The problem with smartUSA's proposed forum is that open dialogue about reliability, maintenance and repair "issues" will not be tolerated there. Look for a heavy hand of moderation, weilding a sledgehammer when necessary.CsC has to be for all smart car owners anywhere, in my opinion, and in a year most of our membership will be US. That's good for me. It's about the car, right?

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The die is cast........Csc, for everyone who loves smart cars. Word of mouth will take care of everything. :)

Edited by SCHMART

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Today's home page has six articles, ALL from a US perspective : Mississipi's Clarion Ledger, Indianapolis Auto Show, SearchChicago, NY Post, freepress.com, forbes.com

They're great articles, if you're American.

The press info page is rubbish, I agree, we need some better stuff to show up on our homepage.

Of all the changes on the switchover, the front portal page was probably the most "thrown together". I didn't want a portal page, then someone (I think it was Deezle) suggested we should have one. The software has a built-in option, which is the one you see. Most people favored it, so it stayed. It hasn't been tweeked very much though. The "news" posts you see there are fed from the News and Entertainment section, which is currently restricted to members of the "Reporters" usergroup, of which right now only Smart142 is a member. He seems to focus almost entirely on USA news releases... I couldn't say why. There was a comment in the past that indicated at least some people feel that is the only news of significance right now because the car is being launched there and its old news in Canada. And that may be true enough, it may just be simply harder to find quality Canadian smart news at this point.

Like so many things... its on the agenda for the January BOD meeting. We have to decide, among other things:

[*]IF we should restrict to "Reporters" or if anyone should be able to post (remembering they get plastered on the front page)

[*]Who the reporters will be. Selection criteria, etc.

[*]What themes of content are suitable

-Steven

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I never see the articles. I log right into the forum area and never see the portal page or articles unless I accidentally click the link.I still think its for EVERYONE who likes smart cars.. I enjoy the value our UK members and our new and old USA members offer. Although I dont read too much about the new cars I think it will evolve like the old sections did. I agree that the official smart forums will be heavily moderated and censored. It is what you make it around here... word of mouth and everything goes a long way. The "You've been spotted" cards that members made up to tag other smarts helped a lot. Maybe its time to start tagging new cars too?

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I never look at the front page. I'm logged in and go to the new posts right away. Which by the way means that the forum organization is of minimal interest to me. I review all new posts. New US regional forums? Okay, didn't really notice them and if they help some people great.This site is about smart cars, not Canadian smart cars, not US smart cars, just smart cars.

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I agree with kwaldron. I'm not too interested in the regional stuff - remember it's for events. I go through other parts of the forum because - hell there might be a squadron of Canadians heading South near me and maybe I'd like to join in. If I don't "lurk" in other topics I may miss out.I have another worry but I'll post that over in the US section as soon as I'm done here.

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I think our focus here must be to offer the best usr/visitor value possible. And I think CsC has done a pretty good job of that so far. As well, this was done with no monetisation of the site; no sponsorships or memberships. This has meant that CsC is not beholden to MB/smart or anyone else. This independence is critical, IMHO.

There shouldn't be any fear of new forums. Many of us cruise the US, UK, German and French-language forums as well as Club smart car. Is it possible that some new North American forum with a little "jingle-jangle" in its pocket may someday overwhelm this place?

So what? An independent and free, grass-roots "critical mass" site like this - with over 3,000 worldwide members so far IIRC - will only die from within. Hands up those who remember funkysmart...

So let's quit worrying and concentrate on content, content, content.

FWIW,

B)

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my take on this is that, if this site's cool, people will come. end of story. if it gets taken over by the u.s members shortly (10 times our size equals 10 times the membership) and becomes too "americanized" then some may leave. or start their own american club. some may leave here for that if its "bigger and better" or whatever.bottom line, a good site brings people in, no matter what nationality. being predominately canadian and discussing our deisels in kmh, etc, makes it worth it for me (along with the nice people ive exchanged thoughts with, good or bad). and i'll keep coming on to see whats new, meet at get togethers i can make, chat with friends, etc.this may be a car site, but ive met many nice folks on here, learned about movies and music to check out, laughed at some good humour, enjoyed our british mates comments, met some very nice quebec smarties at ikea, people like schmart (hi rob and bev), regina (holla, baby), etc from the u.s have been EXACTLY the kind of people a good club would have as members. i dont want them to leave, by going "all canadian, all the time", for example.perhaps a simple idea would be to simply have, on the initial page, an entry point for "new" smart, aka 451. and "classic" smart (like the old coke thing), then let people choose which point to enter into, this way, by default, most canadians would end up in the classic part of the site, featuring diesels, and others would migrate to the new area, focusing on the gasoline version. seems like a simple fix, to accomodate members new and old, and cars new and classic, while allowing views into either if wanted.just my suggestion. it wouldnt matter where anyone was from, it would only matter which car they needed info on. we could become simply ufo's...change our name to Universal Friends Of Smart. or S N A (smart of north america). either way, a friendly "nation-neutral" site, with a portal at the beginning to the new or classic side, which would be easier for discussions about your preferred version of the little car that could...

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This place should be called the s-mack and mike_t site, for that reason alone an American site is imminent

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This place should be called the s-mack and mike_t site, for that reason alone an American site is imminent

Hmm... what site would that be? Something like that MBCanada thing of Frank Mardian's, eh? <_<

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