CsC's Big Hold Card.

[a2jack 1]

CsC is one of the established big 3 of NA Smart forums. There is SCOA, Smart insiders, and CsC. (Yes, Yahoo is in there too) We are #3. What can we NOW do to regain our once held #1 position? #1 Take this site back to a Canadian site, but cater to the Canadian NA451s. Think Canadian, Pitch Canadian.This site is beholden to no one and is the only independent Smart forum among the big three. CsC will win in the end.#2 Back away from the 450 until a new CDI comes out, then, again you will be the keepers of the knowledge. #3 Get out some business card size, club hand outs.#3 Make appointments, and call on each of the Canadian Smart dealer GMs, and Service Managers. Spend some time and talk to everybody, hand out cards. Try to get the GM to let you leave some cards for his new Smart customers. (At same time be a reporter and post every thing you hear right here. #4 Cut back the social forums and build the best Nuts and bolts forums on the net. and Create a Smart drivers forum. #5 The top priority here should be NEWCOMERS. Welcome them and answer their questions, above all engage themin posting on CsC.#6 Shout to the rooftops CSC is independent...That's your Hold Card. There. Just my thoughts. I'm sure all the old 450 guys will disagree.

Edited July 10, 2008 by a2jack

[MikeT 744]

I'm sure all the old 450 guys will disagree.

I disagree with that last comment, which proves your assertion wrong; but this should be in the feedback forum. You make some good points.

[Gent 1]

I'm sure all the old 450 guys will disagree.

[yolanda 0]

I don't think we need to be #1 or to make major changes that will drive off many members. Those who like the social aspect, and all those who drive 450s would likely wander off and we very likely wouldn't have a place to land either.Why can't we integrate the two models on our site more? Tag the info so you know if it applies or not but not have a whole separation like we do?Well if you were to implement these suggestions I think you'd do more harm than good. A huge number of members are 450 drivers and we do a lot of socializing.

[a2jack 1]

Mike T. Election time Signboard. One time only And you drive both the 451 and the 450. Yolanda, and Gent and Mike T. So I'm FOS on some point's. What can we do to stimulate our site? How about the dealer pitch Idea. We must have some strong sales types in our club. The pitch could be home grown Canada club. A2Jack

[fairsider 0]

I'd like to add my two or three cents here for consideration:

#1 Take this site back to a Canadian site, but cater to the Canadian NA451s. Think Canadian, Pitch Canadian.

This site is beholden to no one and is the only independent Smart forum among the big three. CsC will win in the end.

Why limit ourselves to Canada or the US? This site does many things well, and that is why it was attracted a large following in Canada, the US, and even the UK.

#2 Back away from the 450 until a new CDI comes out, then, again you will be the keepers of the knowledge.

This completely misses the fact that there are lots of current 450 drivers out there, and many people who are buying these cars used who have questions about them. There are even folks out there who would prefer to buy a used 450 rather than a 451. Why alienate these people? Why should they have to search an archive when they can ask questions in real time?

#3 Get out some business card size, club hand outs.

Good idea. I agree

#3 Make appointments, and call on each of the Canadian Smart dealer GMs, and Service Managers.

Spend some time and talk to everybody, hand out cards. Try to get the GM to let you leave some cards for

his new Smart customers. (At same time be a reporter and post every thing you hear right here.

Again, great idea!!

#4 Cut back the social forums and build the best Nuts and bolts forums on the net. and Create a Smart drivers forum.

Why? Some folks want the social connection, and the current site seems to handle that quite well. Why change?

#5 The top priority here should be NEWCOMERS. Welcome them and answer their questions, above all engage them

in posting on CsC.

Agreed, but I don't see that this isn't already the case.

#6 Shout to the rooftops CSC is independent...That's your Hold Card. There. Just my thoughts. I'm sure all the old 450 guys will disagree.

Excellent point, but of course I have to disagree because I'm a 450 owner

[garthD 0]

CsC is one of the established big 3 of NA Smart forums. There is SCOA, Smart insiders, and CsC. (Yes, Yahoo is in there too) We are #3. What can we NOW do to regain our once held #1 position?

Ahh, I see we have a similar thread going here too...Why would smart insiders be ranked above us....lots of "noise" but little in the way of actual content.

#1 Take this site back to a Canadian site, but cater to the Canadian NA451s. Think Canadian, Pitch Canadian.This site is beholden to no one and is the only independent Smart forum among the big three. CsC will win in the end.#2 Back away from the 450 until a new CDI comes out, then, again you will be the keepers of the knowledge.

Can't back away from the 450 as the majority of members have that model...can make new 451 members feel welcome and let them know that they will be in the majority in a few years.As for the Canadian thing, well it is touchy and we are discussing this elsewhere but I really just don't want the succesful formula (beyond practical things like adjusting forum structure) that we seem to have here tampered with so that we can "grow" the brand. I certainly don't have any issues calling this forum Canadian, but I also wouldn't want to lose non-Canadian members. I guess the biggest fear is that the forum does take off and grows massively to the point where it become just another American smart forum. There are already numerous American forums out there...don't think there are any other Canadian forums...

#3 Get out some business card size, club hand outs.

Good idea

#3 Make appointments, and call on each of the Canadian Smart dealer GMs, and Service Managers. Spend some time and talk to everybody, hand out cards. Try to get the GM to let you leave some cards for his new Smart customers. (At same time be a reporter and post every thing you hear right here.

As long as this doesn't limit our abilty to criticize the dealers when warranted...

#4 Cut back the social forums and build the best Nuts and bolts forums on the net. and Create a Smart drivers forum.

I personally like the social forums...I like to know the politics, likes and dislkes of other members...makes them seem more multi-dimensional.

#5 The top priority here should be NEWCOMERS. Welcome them and answer their questions, above all engage themin posting on CsC.

I think that already happens here.

#6 Shout to the rooftops CSC is independent...That's your Hold Card. There. Just my thoughts. I'm sure all the old 450 guys will disagree.

Absolutely, independence is important.garth

[kheran 0]

I agree that the "Insiders" just make a lot of noise. Yeah I joined but their site is sooooo confusing to follow or find any worth while content to look at or even comment on. Csc has by far the most knowledgalbe folks on board to combat just about any smart problem. However I think that making the site only Canadian would more than likely offend a whole bunch of members.Total nimber of members will probably drop. I just dont think it's a good idea.

[SCHMART 0]

cream always rises to the top............ I believe Csc is the best smart site.

Edited July 10, 2008 by SCHMART

[lebikerboy 96]

I also agree that Csc is the best smart site around. I'm a member of ...

http://www.smartmaniacs.co.uk/forums/regis...&i=52274790

http://www.smartz.co.uk/?

http://www.thesmartclub.co.uk/index.html

Edited July 11, 2008 by lebikerboy

[Speedie 4]

3, 5, 6 - all over it - plus out here we have a club board at the dealership - that I have to get some material to.I am hoping we get a thing called a membership package together - complete with cards and a decal, useful resource info - cheap to mail out and of lasting effect - as to the other points - I think you will find a lot of different approaches and opinions on them.I think our main thing to grow is to promote membership - and remember that most search engine ratings have a bias for US based sites. Yep - this will be a focus coming up fast in your rear view mirror!Cheers,Cameron

[a2jack 1]

Kheran. In a short time Insiders will be the top dog. I agree it is the worst car site to navigate of any I have been on,However, they are getting organized and their goal is that every Smart car buyer at their dealerships gets a pitch for the club.So far they have not censored negative reports on reliability or service, but many of us expect that to happen. CsC's independence can be the shining light, and IMO going back to being Canadian will enhance that Image. Bring back the .ca you used to have. It made the site standout. A2Jack

[Kitty 0]

I definitely agree with getting the Smart dealerships on board!At the very least, if dealerships were just given a stack of CsC business cards and asked to give them out to all new Smart buyers, and those considering buying a Smart, it would be a great help!It would give new buyers, and potential buyers, a direct push toward this website!It would even be in the dealer's best interest to have unsure buyers visit the site, because while we of course don't just blindly push the Smart on people who don't actually want one, we are very good at extolling the virtues of Smart cars and helping people decide what features they want/need. ^_^EDIT:

Why can't we integrate the two models on our site more? Tag the info so you know if it applies or not but not have a whole separation like we do?

On many forums, user-based tagging requires so much babysitting and chasing after new members who don't know to tag (and members both new and old who forget to tag) that the system falls apart. Edited July 11, 2008 by Kitty

[Awesys 4]

The .ca still exists and still works.I was thinking more of a separation method where there would be subforums for both models, not just one, and then the main area would be for posts applying to both models in general.

[Kitty 0]

The .ca still exists and still works.

It's actually the one that shows up in Google for me instead of the .com

[deezle 0]

In the early days of CsC, I submitted the clubsmartcar.ca address to all the search engines. It used to be a free service. Maybe it's time to submit the dot com addy as well?

I think Gent solved the mystery as to why we still appear as .ca in the google search. Speedie has mentioned that the U.S. based search engines give priority to U.S. sites, so that .ca in our URL might be pushing us to the back of the line on the seach results pages (pure speculation on my part).

[Kitty 0]

I think Gent solved the mystery as to why we still appear as .ca in the google search. Speedie has mentioned that the U.S. based search engines give priority to U.S. sites, so that .ca in our URL might be pushing us to the back of the line on the seach results pages (pure speculation on my part).

I'm not entirely sure that's true, I never had troubles getting to the top of Google for my business website keywords when I used the .ca address (I eventually switched to .com simply because customers often forget an address if it's not .com). What is true is that since search rankings are based partially on user links and clicks, .com domains tend to get remembered more, and thus linked/clicked more often, which helps move them up in the ranks.

It's easy and fast enough to submit to the search engines, so it'll be well worth doing. We should also submit clubsmartcar.com to DMOZ for sure, as that really can help.

[smartzuuk 167]

CsC is one of the established big 3 of NA Smart forums. There is SCOA, Smart insiders, and CsC. (Yes, Yahoo is in there too) We are #3. What can we NOW do to regain our once held #1 position?

#1 Take this site back to a Canadian site, but cater to the Canadian NA451s. Think Canadian, Pitch Canadian.This site is beholden to no one and is the only independent Smart forum among the big three. CsC will win in the end.

Mmmm. no. Why differentiate between the USA and Canada for the new model. We will continue to get in Canada what the US determines they want.

#2 Back away from the 450 until a new CDI comes out, then, again you will be the keepers of the knowledge.

This presupposes were stuck in a 450 cdi rut, which to some degree, we are. It will take a few champions to bring the 451 to the forefront. We should encourage both models growth here, but they do have different needs, and are at different stages. I think we have to continue to improve the forum layout, and soon, If I were admin for a day, I would have it fixed, or at least on the road to being fixed.

#3 Get out some business card size, club hand outs.

We used to do just that. That is how we got this big in the first place. But youhave to have new folks that are enthusiastic and want to carry the torch too, in order to keep this up. And we need 451 owners.

#3 Make appointments, and call on each of the Canadian Smart dealer GMs, and Service Managers. Spend some time and talk to everybody, hand out cards. Try to get the GM to let you leave some cards for his new Smart customers. (At same time be a reporter and post every thing you hear right here.

Not as enthusiastic about this point, but we have made inroads with dealers/sales of course. It's a fine line.

#4 Cut back the social forums and build the best Nuts and bolts forums on the net. and Create a Smart drivers forum.

We need better and more permanent resources for owners. This whole trying to find a thread thing is way too old, and something needs to be done about it. More forums and more topics and more pins will not do the trick. They will band-aid at best.

#5 The top priority here should be NEWCOMERS. Welcome them and answer their questions, above all engage themin posting on CsC.

We need to have the same quality and quantity of resources for each model. Period. Not a sub-forum for cdi. And we need moderation done to keep things organized.

#6 Shout to the rooftops CSC is independent...

Well, that is a given. We've maintained this since day one.

[a2jack 1]

Smartzuuk. Yes you are stuck in the 450 rut. As fine a car that it was. it is no longer being sold. There will soon be lots of of 451s on Canadian roads and most will head to other sites for info if we don't guide them here.As you said, we need more new folks with fresh Ideas. The business as usual, don't make a wave, altitude of the good old 450 boys will not move us forward. Yet, you guys run the show here. What Now?I'll go no further, and even though I've hung around here at CsC for a little over year, I know I am considered, by some, to be an outsider. As a matter of fact when writing my posts here I never know whether to say "you guys or us. But this is still my favorite web site. Regards to all. A2Jack

Edited July 12, 2008 by a2jack

[Caribou 0]

We need better and more permanent resources for owners. This whole trying to find a thread thing is way too old, and something needs to be done about it. More forums and more topics and more pins will not do the trick. They will band-aid at best.

Wiki?

[IMSMRT 0]

oops laggy internet connection = double post!sorry!

Edited July 12, 2008 by I M SMRT

[IMSMRT 0]

I agree with smartzuuk with he business card thing. When it was JUST 450 owners I am pretty sure most of us had and still have a stack of cards in our cars that WE printed ourselves promoting the club. I don't see that CsC necessarily needs to suppy them. If you are enthusiastic take the initiative and print your own cards and tag fellow smarties in the parking lot or wherever.There is still a "you've been spotted" section in here somewhere where you can tell everyone hey I tagged at black and silver passion at such and such a place....that way if that person comes in and see it they can right away see this is a friendly place and want to stick around.As for the other things mentioned well some dealers go out of their way to connect with their customers and sponsor events. Most notable IMHO is TPM in Victoria. There are still lots of dealers out there that are Mercedes dealers that have smarts somewhere on the lot. Not sure what the dealer attitude is like in the US so far but it seems positive.Keep in mind the 450 crowd started this place to exchange our discoveries of this new car. Pushing us aside to promote the 451. We had unique cars with unique quirks and it seemed someone was always discovering new little tricks to get the cars to do something different...anything from turning off the DRL's with the key fob to resetting the service indicator...so far I am not really seeing this sort of "discovery" with the 451 crowd. But I really don't like some of the indications about what CsC should be doing for the members...the members ARE CsC! And if you want to run an event to promote it or hand out cards to new owners that may not know about it take the initiative and do it! A couple business cards with the website name and address on it are not going to be a financial burden...and the more people we have sharing information....well the better the club becomes.I agree that the site format as is leaves something to be desired. It was revamped in a half assed way that made it impossible to find most things we KNEW were here...and you almost need a computer science degree to use the search function....but that can be fixed. The new BoD has already indicated that they will finish it and hopefully it will be a much friendlier place to find what information you need. I again agree with smartzuuk that the 450 and 451 need their own technical sections and not just have the 450 crammed into a sub forum. I also agree with most members that have voiced their dismay about the current set up of the regional sections that they too are a mess.Give it some time...the new BoD is only a few days old really but I am sure things are changing for the better around here....Seanedit: spelling

Edited July 12, 2008 by I M SMRT

[Kitty 0]

I think we have to continue to improve the forum layout, and soon, If I were admin for a day, I would have it fixed, or at least on the road to being fixed.

I agree, but I think it would be helpful to state your suggestions as well as saying that you have some, so the people who do admin can take note and improve the forum. What would you do to fix the forums, and for that matter what do you see as the major and minor shortcomings of the current set up?

I mean, I have a bunch of suggestions about the forum itself as well since I admin and mod a few forums myself, but I'm leaving many of them out (I've already said some in the other thread) because I don't feel like I've been a member here for long enough to suggest certain things, but you're a long time, respected member.

Not everyone will like every suggestion, but I'm enjoying the fact that people are giving suggestions in this thread, and no one is acting like a jerk if they don't like someone else's ideas. There's debate, but no flames, so at least all suggestions appear to be welcome.

We used to do just that. That is how we got this big in the first place. But youhave to have new folks that are enthusiastic and want to carry the torch too, in order to keep this up. And we need 451 owners.

Which again brings up the question as to how big we "really" are.

Also, "used to"? Did the practise stop (or merely slow down), and if so, why? Was the cost of printing/mailing the cards prohibitive? Were members not interested in passing them out? Those of us who are new like me need to know that sort of things, so that while we're trying to think of suggestions to get fresh blood around here, we don't just come up with ideas that have tried and failed, or are ongoing but not visible to the average member. I'm (almost) a 451 owner, but no one's said what they feel people like me should be doing to generate interest in CsC.

We need better and more permanent resources for owners. This whole trying to find a thread thing is way too old, and something needs to be done about it. More forums and more topics and more pins will not do the trick. They will band-aid at best.

What do you mean by "this whole trying to find a thread thing"? You mean the search function? It's true that IPB doesn't have the greatest search, but in order to fix it they'd have to change software. :/

Well, that is a given. We've maintained this since day one.

Problem is, it's not working as well as it should. I'm new, and I didn't know CsC was independent (or that the "other" clubs were beholden to anyone) until these few threads popped up recently. The message may be well known by long-time members of CsC, but it's not being transferred to us newbies.

EDIT rather than double-post:

If you are enthusiastic take the initiative and print your own cards and tag fellow smarties in the parking lot or wherever.

Trouble is, not all of us are graphic designers. I'm not keen on passing out ugly cards that I made; it would give people a bad first impression of CsC.

A simple solution would be for someone to design one or two nice card designs, and offer it as a downloadable .pdf or .doc or .psd file here on CsC. That way, there'd be a nice, consistent look for the cards, and people wouldn't have to try and come up with their own.

Edited July 12, 2008 by Kitty

[B Tisshaw 0]

a2jack

I feel a little odd, never in my life have I been slotted in the "good 'ol boys" group, of anything!

Maybe I feel like I can get away with more given my dubious new status. Marriage to cousins is right out though.

Can't we just all get along? This is not the crips VS the bloods, the Montreal Canadians VS the Red Wings;

we all love the smart, new-old, gas-diesel, I for one think this is a spurious argument; it really ought to be couched in

"smarts against all the rest" context and not 450 vs 451, gasser vs diesel, US vs Canadian; we are all on the same team.

The rush to streamline and create divisions and subdivisions is in my opinion a total waste of time.

I don't share the opinion now that the 450's are no longer in production makes them defacto irrelevant; Deloreans, XKE's, AMX's, original Beetles and countless other out of production cars maintain huge followings.

Bear in mind the 'Ol 450 and earlier incarnations have sold close to one million units in their ten year production run.

Evidently there are more than just a few of us good old boys still interested in the 450.

(Generic use of "boys" which obviously includes good 'ol girls as well)

You raised the point that a core group of enthusiasts generate the bulk of the posts, this is akin to the 80-20 principle, go to other car

sites such as Jalopnick, lo and behold, the same few posters swell the daily blogs with comments and insight.

In my opinion, this is not problematic that a few informed and rabid smartians respond to the vast majority of the queries and comments.

Without the core 20% all of these sites would fall by the wayside. Also, there are plenty of lurkers who contribute when the spirit moves them.

Your last comment "you or us" is a no brainer, you love smarts so it is us. That you have hung around for over a year, makes me hope that you will make it at least two.

The fight has to be out there, not in here.

Don't vanish into cyber space, you have some valid and interesting perspectives to help make the CsC the best club anywhere.

'nuf said.

best,

Blair

Edited July 12, 2008 by B Tisshaw

[yolanda 0]

I'll go no further, and even though I've hung around here at CsC for a little over year, I know I am considered, by some, to be an outsider. As a matter of fact when writing my posts here I never know whether to say "you guys or us. But this is still my favorite web site. Regards to all. A2Jack

Huh, you look like old guard to ME!