Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
MikeT

My 404 Coupé Injection

284 posts in this topic

Nice to see this progressing closer and closer! My friend Dwayne nearly has his V4 Saab ready to be a daily driveable car! 68 I guess it is!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I took the advantage of the current pause in work to clean the old door seals.  The new replicas available these days are too thick and press too hard against the doors when shut and because the rubber of the originals seems to be in decent condition, I thought I'd spend a few hours cleaning one up to see if my plan to reuse them would pay off....

 

Before:

Dirty-seal.jpg

 

Before (inside the seal where the metal clips are placed):

Inside-dirty-seal.jpg

 

After:

Cleaned-door-seal.jpg

 

After (inside the seal where the metal clips are placed):

Inside-cleaned-seal.jpg

 

Thanks to Jérôme Roussel in France for giving me 1.5 metres of metal clip strips, to replace the 1.5 metres of my originals that rusted to FeO2 powder in the 5 years these seals from 1975 were on the car, and the car on the road.  These will all be de-rusted and electroplated in Cadmium and painted, then reinserted into the seals.

Door-Seal-metal.jpg

 

As I noted, the seals were bought by the previous owner in 1975 at Jay's British and European Motors - I still have the invoice - and they were on this daily driven car for five years.  After that the car was in a garage and so the rubber is truly in excellent condition.  Three hours or maybe a bit more with Flitz polish turned them from a rusted, dirty mess into what appears to be nearly new and very soft and supple rubber!

 

After a good wash with a nail brush, the cleaned seal was treated with this Würth stuff and wow did it make a huge difference!

Rubber-treatment.jpg

 

The door-mounted striker plates are not as good looking as they should be so they too will be replated when the seal clips are done.

URL%5D

 

It seems that the spare connecting rod bolts I have are a bit too short so I'll be ordering a couple of sets from Europe shortly.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New conrod bolts arrived this week.  In the fall - October - the block will come out of the car to get the last (I hope!) of this job done.

Connecting Rod Bolts.jpeg

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also bought a rebuilt NOS Hydrovac brake booster from the USA Club 404 representative in Boston, on favourable terms.  It was rebuilt three years ago at White Post Restorations in Virginia.  This will replace the old, old NOS one that has never been rebuilt that is in the car and likely is no good anymore.  I may rebuild the one in the car sometime but not in the near future!

 

Rebuilt Hydrovac.jpeg

 

This will be done after the engine block is out again, so I can get the braking system verified properly before the reassembled engine goes back in!

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Engine's out again, to replace the rod bolts and put the replaned head on again in comfort on the engine stand.  My son is in the photos, helping out today.

IMG-8047.jpg 
IMG-8049.jpg
IMG-8050.jpg
IMG-8051.jpg
IMG-8052.jpg
IMG-8053.jpg

Edited by MikeT
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just out of curiousity did you get the block checked for flatness...?  Was it machined at all?  Even to get rid of those marks it has which could be the cause also of any leakage...?  I personally wouldn't be using it this way unless it was impossible to loose another mm from the mating surfaces...?  I'd hate to have to remove it again but it wouldn't be something I haven't experienced before...lol.  I am finding things get messed up quickly when we take so long to get a job done compared to doing it in a timely fashion.  I have never taken so long to rebuild anything in my life as this car in garage is taking me to complete.....augh!   Just my bend nickel's worth....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The iron block is true - checked with mechanic's straightedge, it is not machinable because the wet liners must protrude a certain amount, and it's perfectly fine in this condition.  I rebuilt one of these in 1987 which looked worse and it sealed perfectly.  The problem with coolant leakage was from the 0.38 mm low spot on the head, which was machined out recently.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good to know, just thought I would ask just to be nosey so to speak.....I have had the nasty situation with an old flat head 4 in a Jeep many million years ago.....it was a sharp learning curve.  I also get all high dollar engines magna-fluxed for cracks again from a bad experience.....augh!  Nothing worse than spending all your hard earned money on a head in my issue only to find out it leaked water into the combustion chamber.....

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This block was magnafluxed along with the crankshaft and forged rods.  All good to go.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I finally got around to whipping the first piston out to do a conrod bolt swap and when I took it apart, the new bearing was scored and after having a close look at the big end journal, the culprit was a significant gouge on the freshly reground crank.  Good grief!

So the work was suspended (though I did change that rod's bolts) and the crank has to come out for at least a machine shop polish or maybe a regrind to 0.5 mm.  I'm glad I decided to take it apart because a gouge like this would probably lead to a rod knock after a while. 

I once had a Renault 12 with a knock (car cost $50) and when we changed the rod bearings, the big end of the knocking cylinder had been punched when the car was new at the factory.

I think I'll look for another place to do this second regrind....ugh

1442905129_scorednew0.3mmbearing.thumb.jpeg.a48ee702fa3fd293906c5c2343bafbc2.jpeg341306165_damgedcrank.thumb.jpeg.cba8c85090d173838a35dc19cebf3741.jpeg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Who assembled the block....the shop or yourself? I have seen it where if you drop the connecting rod hard enough onto the bearing surface on the crank it can lead to this type of mark which will lead to this damage. Just a thought, you can blame who-ever did the long block assembly, maybe...?   This also can happen if when you tap the pistons into the bore and the connecting rod connects with the crank incorrectly ....again just a thought?
i personally would simply use some 3000 grit paper and carefully scuff the crank if you can see the bad spot, again IF it's not too bad....?

It's not like this engine will see hundreds of thousands of kms  imho.

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah work out the blip then polish it out with a strip of super fine crocus ...it isnt that bad and definitely not worth the trouble of taking it all apart and regrinding 

 

sheet happens

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It was assembled by the shop and the reason I took it apart was not to inspect their work but rather to replace the rod bolts, which I had forgotten to do.

 

I'll get it checked and polished professionally and if it stays at 0.3 mm undersized I'll get new bearings, as these ons are really gouged.  If it goes to 0.5 mm I have a new set of shells already in my stock.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Engine is in bits again and at some point I will take it into a machine shop with instructions to clean up the mess the other shop made, even if it means taking the journals down to 0.5 mm from 0.3.

Crankshaft removed again.jpeg

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK, seeing you have it out this far again, i would start as if a new project, triple checking everything required, such as blowing out all oil passage ways for machine filings etc etc. Just because of how the shop did the work they did in the first place. Just for peace of mind. Just because it's basically in bits, may as well.  Starting from step one so to speak. I'd also be checking every surface this shop touched?  Maybe it wasn't them who dented this crank maybe it was...I don't know, but the head work was done very poorly for a well known shop as you say it was...imho so someone didn't check it before it went together. imho.  It's only time and your time is free, so again I'd spend plenty of time checking everything.  OR you can simply repair what you see and be done with it.  IF so then i would simply sand down the imperfections and put it back together as is.  It will run perfectly fine for the time you will run it. Unless you do plan on very long adventuring in it..which i doubt...I may be wrong but I see this as a sunday afternoon type driving machine. Not a multi day vacation trip vehicle where you will be banging on long miles etc etc.  You decide....after all this work I know which I'd be doing...lol.  Getting the microscope out and looking very carefully at everything possible they could have buggered up.

 

Edited by Willys

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good advice.  They did no machining on the block so there should be no swarf.  I will eventually be driving this car long distances - to California and Ontario, but to Alberta for sure.  The idea of sanding down the high point didn't pass muster with me, if this was a $500 car maybe.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Meanwhile I bought a Hall-effect system for the new M50 Ducellier distributor, so points can be dispensed with.

Hall Effct Ducellier.jpeg

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I miss vehicles with points, they were repairable on the road using a cigarette package for gapping and would usually run even if you blew the contacts clean off the arm, just gap it right and keep going.    Electronic crap usually is a one time deal, when it goes, it's done for good.   I say bring everything back that is owner adjustable and serviceable and that all time favorite, the grease nipple.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No moving parts though, just a sensor like a smart Sedrive unit (shifter).  It was as cheap as a set of Ducellier points and condenser would be ($39) for this car and Le Club 404 tech guys say it's excellent and works perfectly over a few years.  We shall see. 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rod bolts are changed, and I installed the two original door seals.  The doors sit better now when closed but still are a bit too "tight" against the seal, so the issue is the thickness of the interior door panels I made, so I'll redo them as a mini-project once the car's on the road.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Latest update: I bought a new set of 0.3 mm oversized connecting rod bearings in case the other shop that now has the crankshaft for refinishing can keep it at the same size. The shop is very busy so it could be another month or more before I get the crankshaft back and can begin engine reassembly. 

Glyco 0.3 mm rod bearings.jpeg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Work will resume in earnest in the fall of 2022. Too busy now with cycling and vacations coming up to do much.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So it turns out that the unions likely were the problem with my new brake lines.

The reason is that the Hydrovac 404s have short external brake lines connecting the two cylinders - these have bubble flares, which I dutifully made, but the fittings that I used the first time were the same over all lines, which in hindsight is not correct, because the bubble flares use about 1/3 the conical taper of the regular flares. So those lines would have been where the air was being sucked in.

My friend Tim Bowles in Victoria gave me a set of used fittings and this is when I finally clued into the problem. So I've removed and cleaned up 4 originals and will make sure to use them on the new lines I make up. Feeling optimistic about this now...

 

Bubble (L) and Regular Flare (R).jpeg

Bubble flare fitting on the left and regular flare on the right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

    Chatbox
    You don't have permission to chat.
    Load More