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Drexus

Failed Start: 450

28 posts in this topic

Drove my 450 yesterday. Has always run great.Covered Bases:- New battery- New battery cables- New starter- Fresh Fuel- Oil level correctPoints:- Car has lots of electrical power- Starter turns over the engine quite easily- No engine codes from ScanGuage IIPossible causes:It did rain quite a bit the last few days, but I started it fine this morning. Now, after a day of sitting in the sun, the carpet over the engine cover is soaking wet, and I have no idea where the water came from.Car simply won't catch.Any ideas?

Edited by Drexus

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Update:I've let it sit with all the covers open (floor & engine). The carpet by the battery is wet too.I tried starting it now, and it tried to catch, but then kept on turning over and over.

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OK. What I've found so far is that if I wait 30min the car will sputter but won't start. If I wait an hour, the car will start for half a second then shut off.Question: Is there a oil pressure switch preventing it from starting?

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OK. I've found something.When I wait a while, the car will start for a half second but then shut off. The oil light will blink twice and then stay on.Any thoughts?

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Water in the fuel? Might be an problem unrelated to the water getting in too. Oil light won't stay off until you get about a Bar of pressure going.Get a can of WD40 and spray some of the connectors (this is actually what WD40 is for as opposed to a lubricant) - see if drying them out helps. Good luck with it.Cheers,Cameron

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Does the oil light come on when the car is still running, or the engine is rotating on the starter? Some of the wiring is drenched, that's my suggestion. Maybe the windshield leaked onto the sAM.

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Water in the fuel? Might be an problem unrelated to the water getting in too. Oil light won't stay off until you get about a Bar of pressure going.Get a can of WD40 and spray some of the connectors (this is actually what WD40 is for as opposed to a lubricant) - see if drying them out helps. Good luck with it.Cheers,Cameron

Well, I let it dry overnight and it's clear there is something the computer is doing. The car will start for a brief moment, but then shut off. If there was water in there, the water separator light would come on. No? The computer isn't happy with something, and it doesn't want to tell me.

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Maybe the computer wants to tell you but you cannot hear it. Can you get access to a code scanner?

Bil :sun:

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Maybe the computer wants to tell you but you cannot hear it. Can you get access to a code scanner?

Bil :sun:

Nothing shows up on the scanguage. I think the oil light is on only because the engine isn't running... it only goes off a few seconds after you start the car, and I can't get it to stay on but half a second.

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Does the oil light come on when the car is still running, or the engine is rotating on the starter? Some of the wiring is drenched, that's my suggestion. Maybe the windshield leaked onto the sAM.

The oil light never came on when it was running. When starting the oil light will of course come on until the car is running.I'll have a look at the SAM, but I don't imagine that's where I'll find anything.

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Update:My guy at the dealership asked a tech if there was anything I should look for. He said check the fuel pump connection on the SAM. So I pulled the SAM and wiggled stuff around. Everything looked clean a dry. For the fun of it, I tried to start the car. It started... and ran. I let it run for 20 minutes. While it ran I juggled the SAM looking for something that would make the car stop. Nothing. So I figured I must have wiggled something back in place. So I buttoned up the car and was going to call it fixed. I turned it off, then tried to start it again. Nothing. Same story over again, cranking forever and won't catch. I tried wiggling the SAM to see if I could get it going again. Nothing.So what if there is no power to the fuel pump... at the pump. How can I check that connection? Does anyone have a photo of that section?

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Fuel pump is the low pressure one - it is in the tank as part of the sending unit, think that is the wrong end of the problem though - probably your SAM has a moisture issue (corrosion on the relay pins or something) - here is a picture of the tank assembly - smart_fuel_tank.bmpBit of work to get at it.Cheers,Cameron

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Fuel pump is the low pressure one - it is in the tank as part of the sending unit, think that is the wrong end of the problem though - probably your SAM has a moisture issue (corrosion on the relay pins or something) - here is a picture of the tank assembly - smart_fuel_tank.bmpBit of work to get at it.Cheers,Cameron

Oh joy... that would be fun to get at. Ok, considering that perhaps it's at the SAM, can anyone tell me what wire & relay is responsible for the either pump system?

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I'm looking for ideas too. I haven't started mine in a month while I changed a broken spring. Tried to start it this afternoon and it cranks but won't catch either. Car has been outside with the front nose section off. I guess I'll check for codes. Does it throw codes just while cranking?

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Well I folded the SAM down too and it started right up. I tried to get codes before that but the scanner couldn't communicate! Hmmmm.

Edited by atikovi

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I'm looking for ideas too. I haven't started mine in a month while I changed a broken spring. Tried to start it this afternoon and it cranks but won't catch either. Car has been outside with the front nose section off. I guess I'll check for codes. Does it throw codes just while cranking?

No codes at all.

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Low battery voltage will do that (crank/no fire).

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BAD / GOOD news.I toed my 450 to the dealership and they told me the SAM was shorting out. They said the connectors going into the SAM are beginning to melt. They have to replace all the connectors and put in a new SAM. 3 hours labour + Connectors + SAM = $1,545.00!!!!!!

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One or two others have reported needing to replace the SAM. Glad it's sorted, but YIKE$$$!Bil :sun:

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One or two others have reported needing to replace the SAM. Glad it's sorted, but YIKE$$$!Bil :sun:

Apparently I've wasted my money. Someone in another thread (Smart Car Discussions/General Discussions) had the same problem and has identified the issue. AGGGGHHH!! I could have fixed it myself!!

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One or two others have reported needing to replace the SAM. Glad it's sorted, but YIKE$$$!Bil :sun:p.s. I wonder what the SAM is called in German?

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Apparently I've wasted my money. Someone in another thread (Smart Car Discussions/General Discussions) had the same problem and has identified the issue. AGGGGHHH!! I could have fixed it myself!!

Could you point us to the thread please?

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