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PrairieBoy

Smart Fortwo Electric Drive:

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I e-mail Mecedes-Benz Canada with inquiries,(and critisism) concerning the information available on the coming Smart EV. This was their reply: "Thank you for your e-mail." "Currently there is only a pilot program of the electric smart." "Here is the progress of the pilot program as of now: The Toronto Hydro Smart Experience launched on Nov 29.(2010),and we are currently selecting our 15 Lead Ambassadors. Hear are the details of the Toronto Program: The Toronto Hydro smart experience will provide 15 selected Lead Ambassadors with the following: -smart for two Electric Drive lease for #545/month,for 48 months,including unlimited kilos per year. -Free 4 year,80,000 KM vehicle maintenance and road side assistance. -Winter Tire Package. -Smart for two Electric Drive Welcome Kit. -Free home installation and use of a home charging station,free of charge during the term of your lease. -Free charging at public and select smart Charging stations. -Distinct government issued 'green ' Licence plate,allowing special access to HOV lanes. -Emmision free peace of mind. "At this time we are focusing on launching one city at a time in order to make the program the best possible experience for all those willing to participate.""At this time we are unable to advise on when or if this program will be launched in Saskatoon." "However we can advise that we will be releasing the Electric Drive smart to the general public as of model year 2012.""Smart Canada's web site will be updated with further information including the cost in the near future." ( some of this info is also available on smart canada's web site under'Toronto hydro smart experience')So in conclusion,is this information enough to make you want one? I'd be interested if any of our club members would buy/lease based on this information. -

Edited by PrairieBoy

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Possibly, but I would need way more info on the car,bateries, warranty and charging issues/stationsWhat's the base price of these units? top speed?

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Canadian base prices are as yet unknown.Actual warranty is unknown. Smart has limited this car's top speed to 100 Kilometers Per Hour,for some reason, so this model will be a 'city car'.It will probably be charged at home by most people.Nissan's electric 'Leaf 'will do 90 MILES PER HOUR,so i'm more interested in it.It would seem to be a more 'usable' car,for more people, and could be used for commuting INTO the city,by some. Nissan Canada is warrantying their batteries for 8 years,with a life expectancy of 10 years.The Leaf constantly updates the car's own GPS display,with where,and how to find all the charging stations. Once a 'quick charging' network is in place,many more people will be able to drive these electric cars practically anywhere,but this will take some time.

Edited by PrairieBoy

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It is the perfect smart for those people who want a smart but mainly drive it on short trips in the city, which is notoriously bad for engines, and most especially for the diesel. 100 km/h is fine even on the highway, where 110 may be the limit here and there, but 100 is close enough IMO. No doubt they could let the EV smart go 140 but then the battery would drain in - what - 20 minutes?The 142 km/h Leaf would be the same, more or less. If you drive it at 142 km/h, the battery juice would probably be gone in under 30 minutes. Short, fast-ish trip.

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-Free home installation and use of a home charging station,free of charge during the term of your lease. -Free charging at public and select smart Charging stations. -Distinct government issued 'green ' Licence plate,allowing special access to HOV lanes. -Emmision free peace of mind.

Free charging station and free charging! Is this program coming to Ottawa?My commute everyday is about 40km's return. Average speed in traffic is 60-80km/hIn off peak hours I can drive @ 100km/h no problem (our 417hwy is not the 401 where you have to drive 120km/h minimum!)This car and program would be perfect for me. My current car payment is $340 per month. Gas this month is @ $130 so I'm not that far off the lease price. Free winter tires and rims and this makes this great value!

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Yea, I think it sounds pretty good too, but it would be nice if the government was really serious about the enviroment and would offer really good insentives like they do in Europe where they pay 1/3rd or something like that.Anything to stop the internal combustion engine for good, and all this relying on oil problem.I know building the new cars will take oil as well, but at least they don't pump it out the tailpipe giving everyone cancer and wrecking the planet.If I could afford a new electric one day we just might buy one.

Edited by Coast Steve

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Coast Steve: See my new post in the 'Auto talk' forum from Nissan regarding their electric car the Leaf,and B.C.,Quebec,and Toronto,Ontario.

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Mercedes-Benz just e-mailed me and said that they are hoping to expand the 'Toronto Hydro Smart (EV) Experience' to Vancouver ,B.C. very shortly! Good news for those early EV adapters.I dreamt i was driving an electric car last night. I remember enjoying using the regenerative braking to re-charge the batteries while coasting down hills.Maybe I was in Vancouver last night in my dreams! At least the dream was free.

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The only thing about driving in (the City of) Vancouver is that mostly, you're stopped or under 30 km/h. Perfect place, and climate, for a full electric.

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Jan. 26 2011

Smart USA has delivered the first of 250 Fortwo Electric Drive cars as part of an early-adopter leasing program. The lease rate is $599 a month for a coupe and $649 a month for a cabriolet, not including a security deposit, tax, title, license and dealer fees.

The lease price factors in a $7,500 federal subsidy for electric vehicles. State or local subsidies might be available to further reduce the cost.

Drivers interested in owning an electric car must also factor in the cost to have their home inspected by a certified electrician and, if necessary, pay to have a circuit added. This can cost anywhere from $300 to $3,000, sources say, depending on where you live and what type of work needs to be done.

At a rate of $599 a month for the required four-year lease term, owners will pay a minimum of $28,752 for a Smart Fortwo Electric Drive.

The Nissan Leaf electric car, which seats five instead of just two, starts at $26,200, including the federal subsidy. It is more powerful, more comfortable and can go farther on a single charge than the Smart Fortwo.

The first Fortwo Electric Drive owner, Mindy Kimball, 36, of Silver Spring, Md., is a major in the United States Army and volunteers at The Climate Project, a nonprofit associated with Al Gore that educates on climate change. She is also an active member of the Electric Vehicle Association of Washington, D.C. Her background is exactly what Smart is looking for as it selects Fortwo Electric Drive owners: They must have enough knowledge and interest in electric cars to act as ambassadors.

Besides private individuals like Kimball, Smart is targeting companies, municipalities and other organizations willing to commit to a four year/40,000 mile lease. Geographically, the company is focusing on areas that already have charging infrastructure in place or have federal grants to get it up and running.

The Smart Fortwo Electric Drive uses an electric motor powered by lithium-ion batteries. On paper, it’s supposed to be able to travel up to 98 miles on a full charge. But in combined city and highway driving, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency estimates the range to be 63 miles.

Using a 220-volt outlet, the batteries take 8 hours to fully charge. They take 3.5 hours to charge from a state of 20% to 80% capacity.

Last fall, I did a short test drive of the electric Smart Fortwo in the photo to the right and found it to be just fine for basic transport. It accelerates like a normal car, but when it gets up to 40 mph or so, the power plateaus — push the accelerator to the floor, and it just slowly picks up speed.

Other than the propulsion system, the Smart Fortwo Electric Drive behaved just like a regular Fortwo, which is to say that the ride is a bit choppy, but surprisingly stable for such a small vehicle. You don’t feel like you’re driving a clown car, but the interior isn’t nearly as quiet or accomodating as that of the Nissan Leaf.

Smart will use its early adopter program, which it calls “Team 250,” as a way to test and improve the electric-drive technology, much like Mini has been doing over the past couple of years with its own lease program for its experimental Mini E electric car.

......................

Source.

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This is the main problem with the smart ED (besides the name): silly pricing.

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Still no pricing for the production model 2012 smart electric drive. What prices you are reading are for the 250 North American testers, one batch of the 1000 prototypes with Tesla battery packs and motors.

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This is the main problem with the smart ED (besides the name): silly pricing.

agreed. competition should take care of that.

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USA TODAY Jan 27, 2011 By Chris Woodyard

Roger Penske drops off first Smart electric car in U.S.

Smart has delivered its first electric car -- and racing legend and Smart USA top dog Roger Penske delivered it personally.

The car went to Army Maj. Mindy Kimball who lives outside Washington, D.C., and is a big believer in the potential for electric cars. The car is the same as the Smart minicar on the roads already, except this one is powered by batteries that allow it to go up to 98 miles between charges. In mixed driving, it is government-rated as having a 63-mile range. About 250 of these Smart electrics are up for grabs, but the next generation won't go widely on sale to the public until 2012.

Smart USA says Kimball chose the Smart ForTwo electric minicar after checking out alternatives. She is a member of the Electric Vehicle Association and plans to display her new car at the 2011 Washington Auto Show.

"This is a groundbreaking day for Smart in the United States," said Smart USA CEO Jill Lajdziak. "We are extremely excited to add the Smart ForTwo electric drive to the Smart product lineup, solidifying our position as a key player in transportation electrification."

.....................

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649 a month is more then I pay for my house! I can 't even think about buying/leasing this car till it comes down in price (Well under $400)

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http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/28/smart-u...fortwo-electr/#

Another article on the same topic today....

Smart USA won't be stopped by snow, delivers first Fortwo Electric Drive to a customer

Hertz may have been the first to get the suckers on the road, but Mindy Kimball of Silver Spring, MD is the first American customer to have a Smart Fortwo Electric Drive of her very own. She's a US Army Major and now has a funky little green (but not olive drab) and white coupe at home -- probably buried under a foot or two of white stuff at this point. She's member numero uno of Smart USA's so-called "Team 250," which will make up the first 250 owners of the cars, each of which offer a maximum of 72 miles of range and a top speed of 70mph. All while looking super cute.

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The only thing about driving in (the City of) Vancouver is that mostly, you're stopped or under 30 km/h. Perfect place, and climate, for a full electric.

Anyone hear how these would do in -20C? The main concern that I would have is the ability of the batteries to hold a charge in extreme cold temperature's, or basically January/February in Ottawa!

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The Li-ion battery in my Sony DSC camera died in Québec at minus 15 after an hour, only to come back to life in the Hotel Frontenac at 22 C. So I am thinking that in cold climates they will be a burden.

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Maybe they will use some form of electric battery heat,such as when the vehicle is plugged in and being charged.The batteries must also give off heat when being charged,and this would help warm them up. A cold battery would have some effect on range,i imagine.Possibly shorten it's life too.About the leaf's batteries: Nissan says:("battery capacity decreases with time and use;actual range will vary depending on driving/chargind habits,speed,CONDITIONS,WEATHER,TEMPERATURE,and battery age").I'm sure the makers of all the 'EV cars' will take this into consideration,or they wouln't be considering selling them worldwide.In the Nissan Leaf,you are able to heat the car's interior,while it is plugged in.You can do the same with the car's air-condtioning too. Nissan says this can be done "even when the car is powered down".(according to their press release.Attached)

Document_2304_1_.pdf

Edited by PrairieBoy

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Somewhere on this web-sitet here is a link posted by 'Mike',that says there are 26 smart electric drive cars in Canada already. I can't find the link again.

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Well, it was the first result in advanced search when I input '+electric +drive', selected 'Mike T' as the poster, and another helpful search function is to tick the box to display results as posts...

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A Smart Ride

By Adam Aston

February 1, 2011

Americans are likely to have their first taste of an all-electric vehicle as a rental car. Our correspondent climbs behind the wheel for a test drive.

The future is here. It’s cheaper than I expected, and it’s so small that you could fit two in a single parking space. I find it plugged into a wall charger in the subterranean garage of a midtown Manhattan office tower. It’s called the Smart ForTwo Electric Drive, or ED, and it’s one of the first mainstream, all battery-powered cars to hit U.S. roads.

New Yorkers, of course, have seen Smart cars before. The gas-powered version grabbed headlines two years ago for its ultra-parkability, but it handled poorly and wasn’t much on gas mileage. Electrification fixes both of those problems. The ED’s cost per mile -- the electric equivalent of mileage -- is among the best available. And the added weight from the batteries improves the car’s handling, while electric motors zip it up to speed more confidently.

Sliding behind the wheel, I scan the plastic dashboard for the high-tech display that’s become a signature of electric vehicles. Toyota’s Prius set the standard with an animated diagram of the energy flowing through its systems. But the ED disappoints on that front: The first giveaway that you’re in an electric vehicle is a pair of simple analog gauges perched atop the dashboard showing the status of the battery. "Well," I think, "that’s one way to make drivers less distracted."

Despite being one of the smallest cars on U.S. roads, the Smart ForTwo is surprisingly roomy inside. The electric motor is tucked between the rear wheels, so there’s no engine under the hood, opening up plenty of height and leg room to situate my six-foot frame. Peering forward from the drivers’ seat, practically nothing is visible of the blunt hood out front. The side windows wrap in closely on both sides. The combined effect feels like I’m hovering in a bubble -- a sense exaggerated by the car’s silent motor.

Smart’s dimensions will never offer the tank-like comforts of an SUV, but as I dart through holes in traffic that no other car could fit and nimbly dodge potholes, even on slushy roads, I’m grinning. The ED may be pint sized, but it’s got great self-confidence, a plus for any newcomer to New York.

Visitors to Manhattan, San Francisco, Washington, and soon other cities can now borrow this eco-novelty for as little as $6 per hour thanks to Connect by Hertz, an hourly car-share program. That’s a real deal given that, while not yet for sale, EDs are being leased for $600 per month by Smart, a subsidiary of Germany’s Daimler.

It’s also a sign that the electrification of America’s vehicles probably won’t begin in suburban driveways. Consumers are more likely to get their first exposure to these high-tech vehicles as rentals in cities. Rental companies are eager to burnish their green cred while tapping public interest in the novel vehicles. "Hertz is the first to provide consumers with electric vehicle access on a global scale," said Mark Frissora, Hertz’s chairman and chief executive officer, in a statement. "We look forward to… making electric mobility a reality for consumers worldwide."

The five Smart EDs that Connect by Hertz has for rent in New York City are just a start. Over the next two years, it plans to add 1,000 battery-powered cars nationwide. Enterprise Rent-A-Car likewise aims to buy 500 no-gas Nissan Leafs for its fleet. Even the exotic Tesla Roadster -- the battery-powered, $109,000 super car -- can be rented out for $25 an hour through Getaround, a new car-sharing startup. Plug-in hybrids such as Chevy’s Volt, which rely mostly on batteries but also have a gas engine for extended range, are now or will soon be offered by Avis, Enterprise, Hertz, and ZipCar.

Other than the Tesla, electric vehicles have been practically invisible since GM’s ill-fated EV1 made a short-lived splash in the mid 1990s. This time, they’ll stick around, says John O’Dell, senior editor at Edmund’s GreenCarAdvisor.com. Both policymakers and auto execs like their efficiency, low-carbon emissions, and lack of reliance on foreign oil for gasoline. Even when drawing energy from coal-fired power plants, their carbon footprint is lower than petroleum-fueled cars, according to a joint study by the electric industry and the Natural Resources Defense Council.

"Governments in China, Germany, Japan, and the U.S. -- all driven by worries over oil dependence and climate change -- are setting sales quotas, incentives, and efficiency standards aimed at electric vehicles," O’Dell says. Global automakers that don’t have battery-powered models ready to meet the new standards, he adds, risk being barred from those markets.

A $7,500 federal tax credit for all-electric vehicles is spurring their adoption here. As part of a commitment to put more than 1 million plug-in cars on the road by 2015, the White House last month sweetened the pot further, proposing a suite of incentives, including converting the tax credit into an outright rebate so that consumers can get the money at the time they buy, not when filing tax returns.

For now, though, battery-powered cars barely show up in America’s huge auto market. About 1,300 were sold in 2009 (the most recent year for which data is available). Sales are predicted to grow quickly to 90,000 cars by 2015, predicts market analyst JD Powers. By comparison, sales of gas-electric hybrids hit 292,000 in 2009 and are on track to exceed a million over the next few years. Toyota’s Prius accounts for more than half of all hybrid sales.

For all the hype, electric vehicles are a technology in flux. Just as the earliest gas-powered cars -- think the Model T -- were clunky, the first generation of mass market electric cars are limited in performance and dominated by designs adapted from existing gas models. The good news is that Smart’s ED microcar may mark the end of an era when electric cars were synonymous with small. Here-now and here-soon models, including Nissan’s Leaf and Ford’s electric Focus, both of which I checked out at the recent Detroit Auto Show, are comfortable, full-sized five-passenger vehicles.

Smart’s ED embodies much of the promise and many of the shortcomings of first-generation electric vehicles. First among those questions: how far can it go? For this car, the answer is 80 to 90 miles, depending on whether you’re driving aggressively or cranking the AC to Arctic temperatures (not a problem this month). That’s plenty of range for most, given that drivers travel an average of about 30 miles per day in the United States. Range is even less of a concern in cities, where trips are shorter. While "range anxiety" may be a persistent concern for car-commuting suburbanites, today’s EVs are well suited for urban driving.

Recharging is the other big question. For my test car, plug-in duties are handled by the attendants at the commercial garage where the ED sleeps. A wall-mounted unit, made by ChargePoint -- one of a growing number of charger makers, including AeroVironment, Coulomb, EcoTality, and GE -- sprouts a hose-like cable that plugged into the car where a gas cap would normally be. This station feeds 240-volt power into the car, recharging it to 80 percent in under four hours and fully in about eight.

The success of electric vehicles will depend hugely on how public recharging networks evolve. As part of a $100 million federal program, The EV Project is building thousands of charging stations in Oregon, Washington, California, Arizona, Texas, Tennessee, and Washington, D.C. Private players are emerging to be a major provider of such infrastructure, too. "For a store or movie theater, installing recharging stations isn’t a huge cost, even if they give away the power, and that lures customers in," says O’Dell. "If you had an electric vehicle, would you go to the coffee shop with a free charging station, or one without?"

During my own test drive, the ED felt sure footed hitting highway speeds. But once I rolled into Queens, the preponderance of trucks and SUVs on the road reminded me how small the ED felt. It’s three feet shorter than BMW’s MiniCooper. EVs don’t have to be tiny, of course, but many of the more affordable, early models are, because smaller, lighter vehicles require fewer of the costly batteries that drive up their price.

Midway through my e-road trip, I pulled into the parking lot of the Bel Aire Diner, a Queens classic with a phone-book sized menu.

Getting out of their beefy trucks, two similarly beefy drivers stopped, in unison, to grill me about why my little car was sporting plug symbols on its sides. Their mild skepticism shifted into tentative enthusiasm when the discussion moved to fuel costs. With gas inching back up toward $4 per gallon in the city, both griped about the eye-popping, three-digit costs of filling up their dreadnaughts a few times a month.

When they asked me what it would cost to fuel my e-car, I made some quick mental calculations. "Maybe $20 or $30 depending on your daily distance?" I said.

"Thirty dollars per fill up?" shot back the guy in the big red Ram pickup. "No," I replied, "Per month."

"What? You should buy lunch then!"

Maybe next time.

..............

Adam Aston is a freelance journalist and editor who focuses on green issues. Previously, Adam was energy and environment editor at BusinessWeek, where he wrote and edited stories about corporate sustainability, renewable energy, and green finance ......

................

Source.

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