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cadillacman

Egr Removal

30 posts in this topic

you don't deserve my input

 

Edited by cadillacman
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Re the exhaust leak at the turbo to EGR pipe connection. Mine had a persistent leak there that just kept coming back, MB "fixed" it three times under warranty, twice with a new turbo, once with just the gasket. After warranty I tightened the bolts (quite loose) once, put up with the noise and soot in the area for a long time, got Flying Tiger to change the turbo once (over 120 K on it, and I had picked up a very low-mileage used turbo so not too bad), tightened the loose bolts yet again after it came back yet again. Finally with my clutch replacement I was able to find the real culprit; distorted flange on the EGR pipe. Can't properly clamp the gasket's sealing area. A blocking plate with shaved-down ears to compensate for the distortion is in, and I don't expect a recurrence. A few stroke with a sharp file to remove the flange distortion would have worked just as well. (Easier said than done, the EGR pipe would have to be removed to reach it.)

Edited by Alex

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I also removed the cooler completely and have found that the pipe was loose when I took it off. The last time I had my xframe off, the block plate was loose again! Since then, I've used exhaust studs and found two locking copper nuts to hold the plate in place. No leak so far :)

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and they expected that little metal seal to handle that ?

No, they didn't. In their engineer's perfect world flanges don't distort, so no need to allow for that little factor!In my field I have modified one particular part on a machine twice now, (two separate machines, same part) and the first time informed the factory of the field problem and the solution. Perfect performance on my modification, I'm going to have to do it to a third machine now, I called my contact to check if they had a solution yet and I learned that they have had a lot of problems with that part and are now into their fourth re-design. I think I just may have now convinced them that my proven retrofittable solution might be worth considering. It is really simple, cheap and easy BTW.Factory engineers! Listen to the guys in the field, they often have a clue, ya know.

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It may be difficult to find them but if you use studs instead of bolts with red lock tight on the turbo side that will keep the studs from backing off. Then get 4 nuts, install one nut per stud to start then use the other 2 nuts as jam nuts. Pretty extreme option but should work.

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seems easy enough, I have seen that it's easy enough to reach with the TIK pipe and waste gate acutators removed. I`ll probably do this when i pull my EGR, and clean my intake/intercooler.

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I got the egr and egr pipe off, cut off a flange from the egr pipe and used it to clamp down the block off plate that came with the egr sim. installed the canadian tire pipe after cutting it down and it fits like a charm. used my welder to put a bead on the pipe.

If you remove the waste gate acutator the egr pipe bolts at the turbo become quite accessable with an allen key. just use pliers on the key to break the bolts loose. Mine were practically finger tight, weird.

Just need to get a 90 degree fitting for the coolant pipes and then i can cut out the egr pipe, it;s just hovering in the engine bay right now till i can get the right piece. Does anyone know off hand what size the coolant hoses are for the egr pipe?

Edited by AzrielStrife

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Someone mentioned in the other thread to use a 1/2" PEX coupling for hydronic floor heating from Home Depot.

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I've got one. but i was wondering if anyone thought of installing a small cooler in this loop instead of just sending it back?

On my highway trips i get up to 4 blobs on the temperature on the big hills, seems like the system could do with a bit more cooling capacity..

I imagine an oil cooler would work fairly well to pull some extra heat out of the water. run the lines down in front of the engine so the air can get to it.

thoughts?

Edited by AzrielStrife

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I've got one. but i was wondering if anyone thought of installing a small cooler in this loop instead of just sending it back?

On my highway trips i get up to 4 blobs on the temperature on the big hills, seems like the system could do with a bit more cooling capacity..

I imagine an oil cooler would work fairly well to pull some extra heat out of the water. run the lines down in front of the engine so the air can get to it.

thoughts?

You have an oil cooler already installed. . the full unit by your oil filter. You don't really want to take more heat away from the little bugger, takes long enough to produce heat as is. It would also suck in the winter lol.

You should only see 4 blobs for a short period basically caused by allot of strain on the engine by either really gunning it up hill or hauling allot of gear. After the haul or the climb it should cool down to 3 blobs pretty quick.

Edited by dmoonen

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it does cool down to 3 blocs fairly fast. but 4 blobs concerns me because i can;t see if 5 is coming or not.

Also a 1/2 inch OD fitting is too small for the egr cooler lines, it does the trick but completely depends on the hose clamps to keep it from leaking. I'm going to toss this one away and go with the next size up. just for anyone that is looking.

Edited by AzrielStrife

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So, i have this howling sound when I get over 10psi of boost now. it's definitely related to the turbo RPM, because they both increase and decrease together. maybe i have some turbulence in my intake? or maybe one of my gaskets on the turbo block off plate isn't sealing?

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My EGR cooler was lose too and leaked as soon as I test drove the car.

Stickman007's idea is best, 6mm Studs to hold that plate, I used 6 mm bolts and cut the heads off since it was midnight.

Red Loctite on studs and nuts and Loctite 620 on plate mating surfaces.

Do not postpone removing that cooler if you're removing the EGR or you'll regret it, if not right away, you will later.

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Cadillacman started this thread with a nice writeup on the EGR removal and a pic showing use of the "sturdy beaver" with the blanking plate. As I related in a different post, my EGR blanking plate is leaking now after about a week with the newly installed plate, after removing the EGR (which also leaked, and much worse). I currently have the stainless plate from TAFMET, plus an aluminum backing plate on top of that (exhaust stud on one end, but bolt on the other end where i can't reach as easily)

Question here has to do with trying to get a handle on the concensus best method to address this common leak, as there are lots of variations that have been discussed, including apparently this sturdy beaver idea (?)....

The specific issue here for me I believe simply has to do with which way the ears of the plate need to be "feathered" to mate best with the presumably warped exhaust flange.

The feathering solution is offered in a few different posts here and there on the forum, but I've been working in that area of the motor without removing the turbo, which makes getting a straightedge on that flange and then being able to see it is basically impossible, so looking for a clue as to which way to feather the plate. would have thought that feathering the ears back away from the exhaust manifold was the ticket, but the idea of the sturdy beaver makes me think that maybe I should be bending or feathering the plate ears toward the exhaust manifold?

Or maybe I'm all screwed up. Looking for some clarification, as the great info off this forum is sure making all this stuff easier!! (so again, thanks to all for the help so far!) I Likely won't mess with the blanking plate issue for a little while yet, as the leak currently is pretty small, but that gives me time to gather more info here and prepare for the best way to go on this.

cheers

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Might I add for our friend in Oregon that the beaver in question is indeed a shiny, round nickel. Yep, five cents.

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Might I add for our friend in Oregon that the beaver in question is indeed a shiny, round nickel. Yep, five cents.

Hmmm, sounds expensive....

Slightly emabrarrassed to ask, but no real shame here, so.... is the sturdy beaver the same size as a US nickel? (I assume you mean the beaver is a canadian nickel). The occasional canadian quarter comes through my pocket change now and then, but haven't seen a nickel in a long time, and the 6 hour drive to Canada significantly elevates the cost of the nifty fix.

I like the idea. Seems like a lot of folks have complained of the blanking plates (or EGR pipes) leaking, and then leaking again after being fixed, due presumably to the non-flat surface, so the beaver idea is appealing.

I'll also look a little more into the leaky intercooler issue I see mentioned here and there on the same topic of leaky pressurized air, just to see what there is to see.....

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Cadillacman -

Any reason you used aluminum over stainless? Just curious.

And your original post states "slightly less escaping exhaust...". Did this not seal that area, or do (did) you have other leaks? Trying to determine how high or low to set my bar of expectations for this next go at it.

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Any reason you used aluminum over stainless? Just curious.

I already had the cheap aluminum blanking plate I made for the other end of the EGR pipe

And your original post states "slightly less escaping exhaust...". Did this not seal that area, or do (did) you have other leaks?

Yes, my muffler gasket was also leaking, you won't have that one.

The EGR port is VERY well sealed ... still

t

The, uh, "nickel" is installed!

I cut out a new stainless plate, as I wanted to remove any doubt I had about the TAFMET plate with its open "ears" maybe not being as robust (likely not an issue), cut out a new gasket from good gasket material, used a spot of contact cement to affix the nickel to the stainless plate so I could assure it would remain centered while messing with it in that very confined area, and bolted it all into place. Used exhaust stud with a lock nut on the one side (side toward rear of car), but on the other side feeding the stud in was too tricky so i used a hex bolt with red loctite and a lock washer.

So far so good. My first attempt at fixing this with just the TAFMET plate, gasket, plus an extra aluminum backing plate lasted about a week before it notably "popped" on an uphill climb (temp and pressure high). I'm optimistic this cadilacman fix will be the ticket... sure is nice when its running quiet.

cheers

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For the life of me, after an inordinate amount of time fussing and cursing, I found no reasonable way to remove the cooler from the manifold. The engine was lowered, TIK removed and waste gate out of the way. The stupid allen bolts are corroded. I can reach the visible one with a regular allen key but no way to turn it, even with pliers it didn't budge. I can't even get to the hidden bolt and then get a grip on the key. Heck, I don't even know if I've got the right size key! A 5 seems loose, a 5.5 doesn't fit. So I guess I'm stuck with the cooler and pipe.

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