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How to DIY transmission oil

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1.4L is correct you can use atf type4 synth and a suction gun to fill it princess auto under 10$ on sale

fill it untill the oil comes out the top hole at that point put the plug back in torque to spec. ready to go

the clutch is a dry clutch I suggest that you don't play with the clutch motor you need a dealer to teach in to clutch drag point if you move it

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Bottom thing would work as well - basically a hand pump.

Cheers,

Cameron

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High-milers like smartzuuk are contemplating this service but I don't expect it's necessary until well over the 80,oooKm range.

However, it might be a good idea to do it before the 80,000Km if your time is still within the 4 year warranty. And have the fluid analysed to see if everything is AOK before off-warranty...

Others here may be more authoritative in this topic than I.

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Not yet. It was just too nice yesterday when I had planned on doing it. My wife and I dropped the top and cruised down to the lake.

Fred did his. Said it was easy. No cover to remove and just an 8mm allan key. I bought the giant syringe to put the oil in.

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Very good illustrated instructions by Rich in the General Vehicle Maintanance Section today.

Well worth the effort for DIY'ers to change the fluid, as it is easy and cheap to do.

The report I got back from Caterpillar's Lab. analysis showed high contamination from break-in metals and silicon from castings and to quote their report "Very elevated Large Particle Detection readings exceeds the recommended cleanliness levels".

This was at 39,000 easy kms.

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It'll be interesting to see my results - I am sending in tranny fluid and two oil samples shortly.

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Note:

D 21065 is absoutely NOT Dexron III

It is Dexron II-D

I think that pdf is incorrect, in that the MB 236.1 spec is NOT for the Getrag transmission we have

Still looking into.

In the meantime, I have nice, clean, and very likely incorrect fluid in the transmission

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Here is the sample How to in the testsite

http: //tests ite.clubsmartcar. ca/index.php?...9&Itemid=37

comment please!

Edited by FlossyTheSmart
removing broken link

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Here is the sample How to in the testsite

http: //testsite.clubsmartcar. ca/index.php?...9&Itemid=37

comment please!

Simon,

Great work on the new site! Comment re "how-to"s: simple linear, step-by-step presentation is best IMHO. The left-right image placement makes it harder to follow.

I prefer layout like:

text

image

text

image

That's easier to print & take down to the garage as well.

Wonderful work! Thank you for all this!

Bil :sun:

Edited by FlossyTheSmart
removing broken link

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Wow. I would love to have an area to put the docs so that they don't get lost in all of the chatter.

I have seen this in some of the Europe sites and it makes it easy to find DIY docs.

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Note:

D 21065 is absoutely NOT Dexron III

It is Dexron II-D

I think that pdf is incorrect, in that the MB 236.1 spec is NOT for the Getrag transmission we have

Still looking into.

In the meantime, I have nice, clean, and very likely incorrect fluid in the transmission

D21065 may very well not be DexIII, but that does not mean that Dex III cannot be used.

As with all oil industry specs., as the number or letter increases, so do the multitude of specs the product must meet.

Our case in point - D III superceded D II. smart only calls for DII (D21065 in MB world).

DIII will be in effect be a minor overkill, but will do every bit as good a job.

The earlier ones eventually become obsolete. Try to find a quart of the old original Dexron, any place other than an Auto Museum.

I am with Rich on this one. Mobil 1 ATF is my oil of choice even though there are lots of other non-synthetic brands of ATF which would work just as well in my smart tranny.

So why do I spend a few dollars more than I need to? ..... That warm fuzzy feeling just won't go away.

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Makes sense, seeing that most literature for DexIII fluids say compatible with DexIID and DexIIE...

However in this thread, Keith mentions that some of the newer fluids are not compatible with his Suzuki cause of the extra wear the slipperier fluid created.

I did find the OEM D21065 fluid mentioned earlier, but it's listed at $38.50/L per my dealership.

That means we need $54 of fluid to change our tranny fluid, which seems awfully high!

Seeing as I'm 20k from going off warranty, are there any dangers in the long run with running a synthetic DexIII fluid vs the OEM?

I'm thinking along the lines of reasons I wouldn't be using 0W20 (if that exists) or 0W30 oil in my car vs the Mobil 1 0W40 it uses now...

Eddie

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Fred could be bang on with his reply...

Check this snorefest out...

DavidS

24th July 2005, 04:24

I asked Lance Wolrab (of Toyota Supra fame) about gearbox oils and Getrags. This is his reply:

************

Hi David,

I read through the info posted on the M5 board. There seems to be two

conflicting points of view on this, much as there was in the Supra

community. Here are some facts about the 233 that might be helpful:

Getrag and Toyota specify an oil that has an ESSO D-21065 specification.

That ESSO specification is a fancy name for Dexron II. John Cribb and I

went all around the US petroleum industry to try and find a drum of the ESSO

stuff, and discovered that it is nothing more than Dexron II. We were

planning to buy a drum of it and provide it to the Supra community at a

significantly reduced price. Our contacts in the petroleum industry told us

Dexron III is a suitable substitute for Dexron II, and that they are widely

considered completely interchangeable.

Many Supra owners have run Red Line MTL and MT90 without any problems at

all. All the drag racers I know using the Getrag 233 are running MT90. The

only product that is problematic is the D-4 ATF. Dexron III has a range of

allowable additives, and all the ATF blenders use something a little

different. Red Line puts the maximum allowable seal swell in their D-4 ATF

(3,50%) because they are afraid the very light base fluid may seep in

applications with older seals. Other ATF formulas do not contain as much

seal swell and have worked well for many Supra owners including RP

Synchromax and Mobil 1 ATF. As expected, the shift shaft seal leakage

experienced by all Getrag 233s went away while running D-4.

No one in the Supra community changed from the OEM oil to improve

transmission feel. We were all looking for a superior oil (synthetic), and

a lower cost ($45/liter for the V-160 oil from Toyota). No one we consider

a reliable source reported significantly different feel from different

fluids except the RP Synchromax.

It is important to understand the ONLY symptom with D-4 ATF use is that the

shifter will not center when cold. If you move the shifter over to the 1 -

2 gate and release it when cold, it will stay at 1 - 2 instead of

immediately moving back to 3 - 4. There is NO change in how the synchros

feel, or how the gears change, only how the shifter centers.

I rebuilt the transmission in my car with parts from Toyota, and I repaired

the DU bushing causing the centering problem. It was not difficult. It now

works perfectly again.

After reading the posts on the M5 board, it's clear some of your members

have never seen the inside of a modern transmission, nor have they actually

rebuilt one. Some of the comments are amusing for their lack of

understanding. If you like, I can take some pictures of synchros, synchro

hubs, and gears to get a better idea of what is happening inside.

Here are a few pics of the inside during the rebuild process:

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/toobull1sh/a...hayXWDBktdulNe5

You can post any of this on your board if you like.

Lance

************

The gearbox pictures are of a rebuild of a Getrag 233, which is different from the Getrag 226 used in the M5.

David

Of course, that is one of many thoughts on the subject...

Enjoy... :steamed:

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It's "clear". Most of that document is first aid instructions, spill instructions....it is a mineral oil (likely not synthetic). I didn't read the whole thing though.

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Two questions:

1. Is it necessary to change the trany oil in the smart.

2. If it should be changed, what readily available fluid available in Canada meets the specs for this oil.

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Does anyone have a definate answer to what fluid is in the tranny and if we can use something like Mobil 1 ATF vs the opverpriced MB product?

Eddie

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Does anyone have a definate answer to what fluid is in the tranny...

I believe we are still waiting on the MB techies to answer that question for us. Don't hold your breath. :banghead:

...and if we can use something like Mobil 1 ATF vs the overpriced MB product?

Eddie

That is what everyone in the UK is using and recommending, and have done for years. I feel quite comfortable to use the M1 ATF

Bil :sun:

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Easy peasy oil change - lot more pleasant than the auto in the truck (nothing like wearing ATF when the pan finally comes off) and you can get to the drains really easy. I went for Mobil 1 ATF - uses 1.4 liters (actually a bit more) - so get 2 liters - a whooping $18 for all of it. The indicated fluid for the transmission is "Gear oil" but the stuff that came out is not even close in smell or texture (didn't have to do the taste test - unlike other cars that are more than obliging to spray oil in your face to help out) to any gear oil I have ever seen - more like - gee - ATF - so time will tell - I will do an inspect after a bit - but you can insert your own disclaimer here. First the get the butt of the car in the air bit - ramps work wellMake sure you have a drain pan - this is nice one - got it on sale at KMS tools - and rags in case you misspost-375-1216011795_thumb.jpgFind the fill post-375-1216011751_thumb.jpgand drain plugs - they have a hex socket opening and are black (if you bother to clean them off!) - they are on the transaxle (bit with the axles sticking out) on the driver's side (LHD) post-375-1216011757_thumb.jpgClean up the fill and drain area - don't want any crud in there! A rag with some solvent is good.post-375-1216011766_thumb.jpgRemove the bottom drain - you will need a 8mm hex key or socket set - the plug is in there good - and watch out for the "owwy maker" - the muffler support likes forearms for lunch. Be careful to use a good key of the right size or you will bugger up the hex and then you will really be in tough shape. Even the CT ones I am using are questionable - but they were handy and I tend to know when to stop if it is going south.post-375-1216011778_thumb.jpgpost-375-1216011784_thumb.jpgThe oil drains fine with out the top plug out but you need it out so remove it again watching for sharp bits- Once all the oil is out - clean the drain plug and put back in - tightly.Now here is the sweet bit - to fill this sort of thing with out any effort you need this - it is basically a modified metal plant sprayer - don't use your plant one - the stuff for plants is not good for transmissions and vice versa - also stay away from used ones unless you check them carefully for rust.post-375-1216011846_thumb.jpgBusiness end is basically just an outlet - you don't need the o-ring - that is for outboards.post-375-1216011853_thumb.jpgGive the sprayer a couple of pumps - Point and shoot - the only way IMHO to put oil in a transmission or differential - put the plug in and you are good to go! You are supposed to use a sealing compound but there was none on it when it came out - and I will let you know if there are leaks.It takes a bit more than the 1.4 litres so don't get too worried about what to do with the extra .6 litre. Also inspect the used oil for big bits - lots of metallic debris in mine but nothing of note for big hunks. The level of metallic bits is normal but not that great for bearings and such - so this fluid change is a good thing.So happy oil changes - the unit seems even better on the Synthetic ATF.Cheers,Cameron

post-375-1216011866_thumb.jpg

post-375-1216011872_thumb.jpg

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Nice, Cameron, a great photo tutorial!I used a goofy little canister pump with a long hose, the least enjoyable part of this job, and I didn't hitch up the butt end because evilution recommended against it, saying you might not get all the oil out if it wasn't level.

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