boundrybasher

Cnd 2005 CDI no start

12 posts in this topic

Hey Guys/Gals

Long time lurker. Minimal poster here. First off let me thank all of you. Over the years I have found many many helpful tips and support from this site. Invaluable in such tasks as Turbo core replacement, intercooler replacement, glow plugs, axle seals etc. You know, all the hands on these little cars give us. Lol.

 

But on too the show:

Our little smart died a couple nights ago under full gallop and would not start. Turns over but no fire. The strong turning over with something missing eg. electrical/sensor wise. If you have experienced this you will know what i mean.

Checked all the usual suspects:

- SAM connector 11-3, pin 10 all good

- grounds at turbo inlet pipe and 8 into 1 on engine bay good

- alternator turning, battery strong and charged

- buzzing that i believe is lift pump when key on for approx 5 seconds.

- no codes stored or three bars of death ---

 

What would be the next diagnostic to pursue or checks i have missed?

Crank sensor?? if so what is diagnosis other than replace and see?

 

Regards Bryan

 

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It almost sounds like the fuel pump cut out while you where driving. Mine had the courtesy of letting go when I was a home. You can try to hot wire it directly to the fuse box. I don't remember which pin melts (11?) in the SAM but you can find it in the Fuel Pump Relay How to. I just cut the wire from the Sam then added a bit of wire and put a spade clip on it . I connected one end of the spade to a 30A fuse and the other to the box. Its a quick test. I thought my fuel pump under the seat was running too but it wasn't. This is like the headlights where the SAM pins are not designed to handle that many amps. A quick hot wire and I was up and running again. You can clean it up with a relay later but I didn't bother.

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19 minutes ago, Jocko said:

It almost sounds like the fuel pump cut out while you where driving. Mine had the courtesy of letting go when I was a home. You can try to hot wire it directly to the fuse box. I don't remember which pin melts (11?) in the SAM but you can find it in the Fuel Pump Relay How to. I just cut the wire from the Sam then added a bit of wire and put a spade clip on it . I connected one end of the spade to a 30A fuse and the other to the box. Its a quick test. I thought my fuel pump under the seat was running too but it wasn't. This is like the headlights where the SAM pins are not designed to handle that many amps. A quick hot wire and I was up and running again. You can clean it up with a relay later but I didn't bother.

 

its pin 10...

 

the one they mentioned in their post...and said they checked 

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Could it be something as simple as a plugged fuel filter?

Alan

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Compression? Trying to get through all home garage troubleshooting before diesel shop visit. Seems somewhat improbable to cause shutdown out of the blue I would think.

Fuel filter? Considered that but once again just cut out with no warning and no others with similar story?

Obviously the SAM 11-3 connector is the main culprit. Strangely mine is very pristine and the pins look good. Which led me to ask the question if there may be something simple I overlooked. That being said after reading everything I can find on issue their are others that have had failure with no/or very little obvious signs. Low beams and fuel pump relays seam to be in the works for all of us at some point. Just wish I had more obvious attrition to solidify this is the cause!

 

Pushed car out of garage a couple days ago so wife could have here parking spot back. Will get back at more troubleshooting/repairing it in coming days.

Edited by boundrybasher

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I’m not a mechanic but maybe someone can tell you if there is an easy way to check for a slipped or broken timing chain.  Maybe that is why Glenn suggested checking compression.  When I used to do CAA roadside years ago we would see a lot of broken timing belts.

 

Nigel

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1 hour ago, boundrybasher said:

Compression? Trying to get through all home garage troubleshooting before diesel shop visit. Seems somewhat improbable to cause shutdown out of the blue I would think.

 

I don't have the correct adapter and gauge to accurately check the compression by removing the glow plugs (and those can be difficult to remove from a cold engine)

My method can be done using common tools. The fuel lines can be removed using a 14mm open ended wrench.

I then use a 13mm long socket and put it on the right side of the injector and move it side to side to loosen and then remove. I then clean the shafts with solvent and a lint free cloth. Clean the shafts of the injectors and place back.

Jack up right side of the car and remove the rear wheel. Using extensions and T18 socket you can turn the engine by hand.

You will need a second person to turn the engine or feel to see if the injectors push out when turning.

Relatively simple and can be done in about a half hour.

You will need new copper washers/fire seals from the dealer to reinstall. They are inexpensive.

This works for me.

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9 hours ago, smart142 said:

I don't have the correct adapter and gauge to accurately check the compression by removing the glow plugs (and those can be difficult to remove from a cold engine)

My method can be done using common tools. The fuel lines can be removed using a 14mm open ended wrench.

I then use a 13mm long socket and put it on the right side of the injector and move it side to side to loosen and then remove. I then clean the shafts with solvent and a lint free cloth. Clean the shafts of the injectors and place back.

Jack up right side of the car and remove the rear wheel. Using extensions and T18 socket you can turn the engine by hand.

You will need a second person to turn the engine or feel to see if the injectors push out when turning.

Relatively simple and can be done in about a half hour.

You will need new copper washers/fire seals from the dealer to reinstall. They are inexpensive.

This works for me.

 

I don't understand. You remove the injector and place it back loose and have someone turn the engine over to see if the injectors push out?

What about the fuel line?. Do you hook it back up or let it piss all over the place?

How much pressure do you think is needed to pushout a loose injector? 5psi? 25psi? 100psi? 150psi?

 

Here's an idea. Get a rubber hose with the same OD as the injector, preferably sligthly bigger to get a snug fit, shove it down into the REMOVED injector shaft with a compression gauge attached on the other end. Get another hose (I use a clear vinyl hose you can get from HomeDeposh) attach to the end of the injector to redirect fuel into a jar or rag.

This method may not give you an accurate reading but its a lot better. Don't you think? 

 

 

 

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Glenn was recommending the motor be turned over by hand. You would not turn the ignition on and therefore not have fuel spraying out. 

His method would be very effective to know if you have enough compression to start the car, and requires no special tools.

Edited by booneylander
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I like this idea of removing the injector and using a hose attached to a gauge. Friction fitting could be reliable to some degree especially if your doing it yourself.

A 5/8" OD hose about 2-3  feet long should be sufficient to view the gauge while cranking the motor. 

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sounds better than breaking a glow plug to use my homemade compression tester (which is just a hose from an old tester with a suitable 500psi gauge attached to a brake line that is brazed to a drilled out old glow plug)

 

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