Question regarding SAM unit

[ian122778 5]

Hello all, been a while since I posted here.  So my 06 smart has a nasty noise coming from the back, and i fear it is the timing chain scraping.  

 

I purchased a parts car with a few parts missing.  One part, is the SAM unit.  My initial reason for buying it was to swap the engine over to mine, but it has 80k less km then mine. Maybe less work to leave the engine and fix whatever is wrong with the new one?  He said he was getting 3 bars and gave up on it

 

Is it possible to swap the SAM, key cylinder and ecu from my running smart with the scraping sound over to the other?

 

Edited June 24, 2018 by ian122778

[LooseLugNuts 557]

i think you need the cluster too...which kind of screws up the mileage records

 

youll probably still have the 3 bar issue

Edited June 24, 2018 by LooseLugNuts

[ian122778 5]

Ok, so Sam, key cylinder, ecu and cluster?  

 

I realize ill probably have the 3 bar, but that might be easier to fix than switching the engine out, or trying to replace the gear for the timing chain.

 

The last time I had a 3 bar issue, it was a bad connection on the SAM.

[stickman007 309]

Yes it is possible to clone the SAM. Instructions are on evilution...I've personally have done it successfully.

 

If you plan to do any swapping, the best way to do it is to swap everything as a set: SAM, Cluster, ECU, lock cylinder...but you will still need to do calibrations in the end. 05/06 cars have different ABS/ESP controller, so it will not communicate if the 2 cars have different setup.

 

3-bar is a bit vague...do u have access to a decent obd2 scanner or MBSTAR? Maybe more clues if you can find the specific MILs?

[ian122778 5]

Unfortunately. I bought it as a parts car, and have 0 details.  Both cars are 06, one is a pure and one is a passion.  The sam and keys were sold before I got it, but i have all of those parts available in my working vehicle.  Would it still be a clone if i was just swapping them out?

[stickman007 309]

If you put an used SAM into your parts car, unless it its new (unpaired), it will have messed up mileage count - but the car will run. Theoretically, it is possible to match that by hacking the hex dump of the SAM memory chip, but since nobody knows the map definitions, its a dead end - at least outside of my abilities.

 

You could clone your working set: SAM, Cluster, ECU. Since both cars are 06, your ESP should communicate without any issues. But you'll need a cloning equipment, and STAR to calibrate everything in the end.

[Willys 747]

Hi, sounds like a Glenn Job.....I don't know of anyone close to us with a SAM machine, I want one but can't find one at a reasonable cost or I'd already have it.  I also know where there is a few Smarts sitting on a lot, maybe they could be picked at? If you want I could ask around to find out who owns them.....I have two already, if I go without someone else's desires I may just own them all...lol

I live in Pefferlaw, Behind Pines of Georgina Golf course

[ian122778 5]

Your fairly close to me. I'm in Bradford.  I am not concerned with the mileage count so much, i just want to see what isnt working in the parts car before i dedicate my self to a painful engine swap

[Willys 747]

LOL...I'm headed to Bradford today to meet a buddy for a few minutes around 1pm.....if things work out.....maybe grab a coffee if you're not a worker...I'm old now...lol.

Sorry that just got cancelled......so another day soon.

 

Edited June 25, 2018 by Willys

[ian122778 5]

Unfortunately, I'm 6 days a week.  Work more than home usually.

[ian122778 5]

18 hours ago, stickman007 said:

If you put an used SAM into your parts car, unless it its new (unpaired), it will have messed up mileage count - but the car will run. Theoretically, it is possible to match that by hacking the hex dump of the SAM memory chip, but since nobody knows the map definitions, its a dead end - at least outside of my abilities.

 

You could clone your working set: SAM, Cluster, ECU. Since both cars are 06, your ESP should communicate without any issues. But you'll need a cloning equipment, and STAR to calibrate everything in the end.

But for it to be a clone, wouldn't that imply I have 2 working sam?

[stickman007 309]

Yes...the engine won’t know the difference.

 

Remember, all the electronics has to be a set to be trouble free. There are companies that can “virginize” these SAM...or code everything as a set for you. I can only clone from an existing setup. I’ve never used their services, but u might want to give them a shout and see...might end up saving you time and a lot of work from swapping the entire engine setup.

 

if you don’t care about the mileage issue, just install the used SAM, and get somebody with STAR to initialize it. I think it’ll flash the mileage and or log a code in the ecu...but the car will run. You’ll need to recode all your keys I believe.

 

 

[Willys 747]

I personally wouldn't care about the milages, as long as you do not get a constant code being thrown in your face.   Seriously, unless you have a special high valued SmartCar it's not worth it unless you want to learn how the entire system works and want to know how to repair it......as I've been told, make the trip to Glenn one day you're off work in London and get him to do his magic...it's a long drive, but probably the least mental damaging way to repair your issues...unless there is someone closer...?

 

[ian122778 5]

I would LOVE to drive out there.  But, i dont feel comfortable driving this car with the crazy noise coming from the back. I'm beginning to second guess the to.ing chain or oil chain. It sounds like it is coming from the rear right side of the engine, maybe i get lucky and it's just an alternator bearing.  Makes me nervous it goes away when the engine is warm.....

Edited June 26, 2018 by ian122778

[smart142 605]

Those symptoms are consistent with a failing oil pump gear.

[Nigel 287]

1 hour ago, ian122778 said:

I would LOVE to drive out there.  But, i dont feel comfortable driving this car with the crazy noise 

 

Gold coverage Canadian Tire Roadside Assistance will get you there for a hundred dollars per year.  CAA costs a couple of dollars more but will leave you about 20 km short.  Usually you have to be a member for a week or so before they will let you go the distance to stop people from signing up when they breakdown.  That maximum tow will cost them two or three times your membership fee.

 

Nigel

[LooseLugNuts 557]

if i remember right CAA covers the driver regardless of car...you can borrow or lie and they will still tow it as long as youre present...more useful for the money

 

crappy tire covers just the one vehicle

 

last time i checked it was a 48 hour wait on CAA to get full use of membership..i dont know about crappy because i wouldnever recommend anyone to it 

[LooseLugNuts 557]

i think bad oil pump chain will set off red light for oil pressure and rattle on acceleration 

 

but being less noisy after warm up makes sense i guess if oil is thinner pump needs less turning force (easier for it to skip on cold oil)

 

for finding noises i like to use a 1/4 vinyl fuel line and stick one end in my ear then poke around with the other end..sometimes i attach a piece of steel brake line to have a solid tube for poking in around pulleys and dangerous spots ....if you have a cheap tool store around most of them have cheap stethoscopes that work great too

 

 

i put an aliexpress chain kit into mine years ago...no problems with it so far

Edited June 27, 2018 by LooseLugNuts

[Nigel 287]

Canadian Tire will do either a vehicle or a member plan now.  I am also partial to CAA but then I was a contractor for more than fifteen years.

 

Nigel

[Willys 747]

CAA demand that there be a problem with said vehicle, guy who wanted to use this service found out the hard way when he called last weekend to move my bike he just bought from me, they said NO!  He then was forced to rent U-Haul  trailer.   Hmmm...maybe I need to build a small car haul trailer....lol.  I see a small business spouting getting cars down to Glenn...lol.

 

 

Sorry to hi-jack....how often does the oil chain go..? If it's an issue it'll be changed out before it want to leave me stranded...!

 

[smart142 605]

I've seen failures at 150,000 and smarts with no issues at 300,000

Check out this thread to see whats involved with an oil pump gear and chain replacement..... 

http://clubsmartcar.com/index.php?/topic/23443-timingoil-pump-chain/&page=5#comment-305700

scroll up

 

[ian122778 5]

In pretty sure it's my oil chain sprocket.  Sucks. Looks like a big messy job. Lol. Mine has around 250k on it. My parts car, i have no clue what it's like, no Sam has made that an impossibility to check.  

On a lighter note, any interesting ideas in what to do with the shell when im done?  Im debating making it into a go cart.....

 

I have CAA, they picked up my parts car from Burlington and brought it to my driveway.  You should have seen the look on his face when he seen he was picking up a smart with missing lights, panels, bumper covers, fenders, no ebrake and no key... Lol. I tipped him 50 bucks for being a good sport

 

 

That oil sprocket thread gives me heart palpitations....but thank you for the link to it. 

Edited June 27, 2018 by ian122778

[LooseLugNuts 557]

13 hours ago, smart142 said:

I've seen failures at 150,000 and smarts with no issues at 300,000

 

mine had 104,000 when i aquired it

 

i was told previous owner had parked it because they knew something was wrong (then it sat for a year or 2 like that after previous owner fell ill and passed away)

 

i cant find the pictures but it was so wore you couldnt even tell it had been a toothed sprocket at one point

[Willys 747]

On 6/27/2018 at 8:23 AM, smart142 said:

I've seen failures at 150,000 and smarts with no issues at 300,000

Check out this thread to see whats involved with an oil pump gear and chain replacement..... 

http://clubsmartcar.com/index.php?/topic/23443-timingoil-pump-chain/&page=5#comment-305700

scroll up

 

Just asking, don't know why, did you check my oil sprocket out at all...lol   You know, just for shits and giggles....lol.....and what did you see...lol    Inquiring minds would love to know...lol

Thanks Jonathan

[smart142 605]

Sorry, never looked at that.