Willys

Nasty surprise today.....

27 posts in this topic

Well I finally got around to disassembling my summer car's alternator......what a shock..!   Rusted solid.....took serious convincing to come apart!  Everything coated in thick rust and green corrosion on many copper wires deep inside. Deep grooves cut into where the brushes ride and the brushes worn way down also. I'm now on the hunt for a new alternator I fear.....the question is where to slap my money down?  Does one go straight to the dealership and bend over or start the long process of searching for another source? What's the general thought on this....I am almost resigned to simply drive down with lube in hand and bend over....augh!

 

I'll start the calling around very soon today and if I can't locate one monday will be all out search mode.

Anyone?

The beater was nowhere near as bad as this one after a single winter's driving being salted to death.....but I expect it wasn't it's first salt bath......I can't for the life of me see how it even turned easily let alone charged.  But it did!  I did have to unseize it weekly and soak it in WD40 to stop the squealing but it always worked....!  Amazing..!

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Collector rings and carbon brushes are easily replaced. Stator can be cleaned and varnished. Main problem will be to split the aluminium housing halves without  breaking them. Alternator can be saved if there is a will and a fair amount of luck. 

Mine is still in operation on spite of being 4 to 5 years older and having been exposed to similar amount of salt. 

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find a rebuild shop...i might be spoiled there is a rebuilder really close 

 

but mine was so far gone when i got it that the housing had cracked ....he was able to source me one for under $200 cash 

 

there are online sources in the same range ..like rockauto usually has them

Edited by LooseLugNuts

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LooseLugNuts gives good info.  Many times the local rebuilder can source a new off shore one for less than they can rebuild yours.  I think the new starter for my 12 litre Volvo was about $250.  You can also buy a new alternator from Rock Auto for about $200 but try the local guy first.

 

Nigel

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Mine. 

 

212-EEE38-4815-4-F3-A-A09-E-F68744-DA96-

 

17594599-2-FB8-4195-8662-431289-B99-DAC.

 

Now works fine. Only 17 years exposure to road salt. 

 

 

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My 17 year old alternator with regulator and rectifier plate removed. 

 

9F64F626-4616-4245-A4C4-9CD5A7FA5700.jpeg

 

Above photo was shot 28 Dec 18. 

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Axe looking tool is my 400 Watt trusted 1960 soldering iron. You need a good one like that to desolder joints and take apart an alternator.  I bought the iron from a widow for less than a Pound many years ago. 

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I got it apart all except the last step...the inerds are seized solid in the case, used torch to open soldered joints and same desoldering wire.  Damn getting old pisses me off, can't find correct name for anything when I want it...lol. But I bet I''ll find it after hitting post!...lol.

The case is now soaking  hoping it may decide to let go, but I highly doubt it.   It has taken a good amount of beating thus far and isn't budging a millimeter!

I know a rebuilder but he retired last year or maybe the year before. I took the beater's alternator to him for his opinion and he said if it works leave it alone! I didn't...lol... I turned it down a tad to relieve some clearances and it has never even squeaked since. This one I can't even get it down far enough to clean up!  
Tolsen your rings are like new compared to this one. and the condition of the alluminium also....I haven't seen one this bad in years if ever.  So I'll be making calls tomorrow to see what's what...fingers crossed.  I definately do not want to have to redo this job after getting it back together again...lol.

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Hi,

I bought a brand new one locally here in St catharines for 165. It's from china, but works great for 2 years now. Very happy

with it. If interested I xan give you the name.

Dan

 

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21 hours ago, Willys said:

I'm now on the hunt for a new alternator I fear.....the question is where to slap my money down?  Does one go straight to the dealership and bend over or start the long process of searching for another source? What's the general thought on this....I am almost resigned to simply drive down with lube in hand and bend over....augh! I'll start the calling around very soon today and if I can't locate one monday will be all out search mode.

Anyone?

 

Unless you are completely out of options...........you could always pick up a rebuild from Uncle Glenn when you and Nigel join us for our May Dinner meet next Tuesday.

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Well after an hour of work finally getting everything apart and was checked out useable...go figure!    and he had all the necessary parts to repair the badly corroded alternator. Plus he said he'd repair it if it was his, maybe....I had some hope for a $60 cost to get up and running again!  BUT.......?    I started brushing the green away from some of the wires in the windings and he says...hold on...!  Let me see that...? He picks at a single wire deep down and he says, look....!    It is held together by a hair thickness and when touched it snapped!   Good thing I didn't rebuild it even after it testing perfect!   Just think of the work involved in cleaning the old case and painting the parts , then replacing it and then finding out in a week the same wire snapping just to do all this work again!  I also can't get just the windings he says which I was wondering why not..? He says he usually scraps them at this stage.....why...?  You are this far into it, a simple replacement of the windings and bingo, job done cheap! So for $260 I'm the proud owner of a brand new alternator....!  arriving maybe tomorrow.....fingers crossed.  I will be disassembling it and painting it to stop any rusting after removing a hair or less from it to make up the thickness of a layer of lacquer. On his recomondation if this happens a lot he says why not if you can. 
I also said I was installing a clutch pulley and his face when straight to the puzzled state!...lol   I tried to explain why and he laughed....he had a completely opposite theory why they installed clutch type pulleys on cars.   It's not for the reasons why we think we want it.....lol.   He told me an engineer from MB was telling him that he had heard, yep this is what 3rd hand info now maybe 5th...lol.  That it's because the engineers wanted to make sure the computers got a steady supply of juice and not uneven as the engine rev'ed up and down while driving..?  Does it make sense...?   Maybe...?   Possibly..???  To help the regulator from working so hard..?   I do not know? It's only on the very small engines or do larger lower reving engines also use them???? Which would make this theory bunk....and also the theory why we want them.....!  OR maybe to help the alternator from burning out too soon because today's electronics are demanding far more from them and evening out the RPMs may help this..?

What you say all you thoughtful know it alls...whats your best guess...?     We have a day to solve this mystery.....lol

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7 hours ago, TheHandyHobbit said:

 

Unless you are completely out of options...........you could always pick up a rebuild from Uncle Glenn when you and Nigel join us for our May Dinner meet next Tuesday.

I would have for sure if my local guy couldn't get one at a decent price.....got to support the local guy if you can just to make sure he's there when you need him....right..?
See you guys next tuesday....will be making a day of it.

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Forgot to mention....are we all sitting down for Stealership's numbers...????

 

$468 now add tax....lol

OUCH...!

And he was laughing when he said it!    He said he knew the answer before he finished the quote...lol.   He then thanked me for the call...lol   In all fairness he has given me a few good deals on stuff like injector crush washers, maintenance items etc etc

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Found some old photos of my current alternator taken when I opened it out in May 2007:

 

A396C873-2CD4-4C45-925D-9925C0DDFC0C.jpeg

Rotor before cleaning and machining. 

 

059BAF60-EBAF-47DA-8410-0114CFFF9BDC.jpeg

Stator soaking in red diesel, my favourite fuel. 

 

8FDB8532-F368-4CB3-A758-FAE6D54CEF3C.jpeg

Cleaned, machined, freshly varnished and basking in the warm early May 2007 sun. 

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I reused the old bearings. Opened them out too, cleaned and regreased. Bearings are still fine 12 years later. 

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LMFAO....you call that corroded...lol     That is almost brand new looking, before you did an excellent job cleaning it up.  Damn!   I only wish....I'd take that every day of the week and twice on sunday as they say....I'll take 2 windings please....
I bet my new one doesn't look that much better than your cleaned up one.!   It will be getting the same treatment to help stop further issues before going under the gun so to speak.!

 

 

Hmmmm....red diesel....I got dinged for using that way way back.....Was a costly experience as it wasn't being used as a cleaner..lol     I got dipped at the weekly cattle market in the landrover...ooooops.....

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19 hours ago, Willys said:

See you guys next tuesday....will be making a day of it.

What time are you expecting to arrive? ... I am within 10 minutes of Glenn's shop (If I hurry)

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18 hours ago, Willys said:

red diesel....I got dinged for using that way way back

 

try mixing some used black oil in it (filtered of course)

 

someone i know told me that dyed diesel mixed with a bit of recycled engine oil looks exactly the same as clear diesel mixed with recycled engine oil

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18 minutes ago, Leadwing said:

What time are you expecting to arrive? ... I am within 10 minutes of Glenn's shop (If I hurry)

For a late lunch I think.....then an afternoon at Uncle Glenn's shop chatting.....etc etc.
Hoping to get there earlier but one of has an appointment..lol..

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Well....I'm the proud owner of one shiny new alternator    with new clutch pulley installed. Looks a bit big but only just....we'll see soon.  Now waiting for English connection to show up...

 

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My spare and shiny alternator is resting under my sofa. 

298915AD-1D3F-4940-9CFB-84AE7D55C054.jpeg

 

69C1B75A-55C4-4936-86FB-2AD69ECF6CD4.jpeg

 

E04187AF-7EB9-4F3F-96B8-23CE42511953.jpeg

 

Some of you may remember this is one I bought second hand on ebay. It was a Smart 451 Cdi alternator until I replaced its regulator so it will fit and work on my 450. 

This alternator cost me a total of around £30  Got it for about £50 and sold its regulator on ebay for just under £50. 

 

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So that pulley fits on a 450 diesel......without any interferances..???   IF so mine should fit easily...it is 1/8" or so wider pulley wise....which started me thinking....I have no memory banks left to remember how close it was to frame..?....lol.  The pulley also needed a special tool to install it onto alternator....a multi splined tool that fit inside clutch .....then burped on. The other  issue is that the pulley has one extra groove for a wider belt but I can't see that being an issue as the first grooves line up with stock pulley.

 

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That tool is available on eBay. I have one to lend if you are close to st catharines.

Dan

 

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Pulley in my photo above costs more than £100 from Mercedes. Comes fitted as standard on a 451 Cdi. The cheaper alternative is the INA discussed in the other thread. That is what my alternator has fitted just now.  The original aluminium pulley had no more grooves left on it. 

Your local alternator man is not smart or bright enough to appreciate the benefits of freewheeling pulleys. 

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