Hobbitz

05 CDI very slow

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Please help, I've a 450 CDI 2005, I have no power, it's not in limp mode, I've fully cleaned EGR, injectors, new turbo ,wastegate and actuator, only code showing is a glow plug, it reves to 4500 but so gutless, I'm about to sell the thing it's driving mad, please help if you can, ps even with the new turbo it's only reading 9 psi of boost pressure ☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️

Edited by Hobbitz

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Posted (edited) · Report post

I  used to post here about the tunes I offer for the 450, but stopped ages ago due to little interest.   The CSC people who used me were completely happy.    I'm in downtown Toronto and still tuning...  You can contact me at mark@dsylva-tech.ca if you like, a phone number is available on my CONTACT page or I can call you.      www.dsylva-tech.ca

 

Thanks

 

Mark

Edited by MarkD
typo

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Hobbitz....take your inter cooler out and check the forward bottom edge of the tubes as that is where they usually get rubbed right through. You get a hole and there goes your boost pressure.....you can buy a new one if you wish or do a spotless cleaning of tubes inside and out then clear tube fins away from damaged area and use JBWeld the fast semi liquid type so it will flow around the tubes but also harden quicker.  It'll take many coats but it does work and far far less money to repair it over spending for a new inter cooler. Yes it will test your patience for sure making 1000% sure those tubes are perfectly clean of any oil solution....but again worth it after you are done.

Also once out trim off the scoop's edge by 1/4-1/2 inch so it never gets chance to damage the cooler ever again.  It's just the bottom edge that requires trimming and maybe a few inches up each side....it's a common issue.

Also this isn't a nippy car off the mark at the best of times....I compare it to a 5 ton truck in it's excelleration capabilities...lol. You must pick your spot in traffic well in advance as so not to get run down...lol. But once up to traffic speed it's perfectly safe etc....lol

 

Edited by Willys

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Posted (edited) · Report post

yeah boost pressure doesnt sound right 

 

find the boost problem ...my guess would also be intercooler leak but maybe whoever changed the turbo didnt adjust it properly for max boost.....i cant say for sure but i think 21 is the highest you can go before it gets an overboost code and goes into limp

Edited by LooseLugNuts

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Even with a well holed intercooler boost pressure should not be that low. 

 

Problem most likely to be seized EGR valve if there is black exhaust smoke. Otherwise incorrectly adjusted waste gate as already suggested or popped off or leaking hose somewhere between turbo and inlet manifold. 

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You shouldn't need to be pulling 4,500 RPM on a regular basis for proper operation.

 

It should pull relatively strong (for a small 3 cylinder diesel) from about 2,500 to 3,500 if all is working as it should.  There should be no need to visit the 4,000 RPM+ range for any reason.

 

Try following some of the suggestions above and keep us updated please.

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Thanks for the replies sirs..

Presently sat in the scamp having a smoke and beer (in the garage) lol ...well first off I installed the newish turbo manafold assembly as i am a mechanic, well 25 years ago, the wastegate/ actuator has the correct preload and is in mint condition, there's no signs of leakage around the hoses from the turbo to IC nor EGR to IC. From idle in neutral slamming foot to floor it literally takes 1.5 seconds to get from 850 rpm to the limiter at 4600 ish, idles smooth, on the road it's smooth but so slow barley crawls of the line, I can hear the turbo start to spool at around 2800 but I can tell it's not spreading its wings so to speak, it doesn't whistle,it's not getting up there like before, maybe I need that star obd2 reader for some kind of sensor, or could it be low fuel, it doesn't smoke, the clutch is adjusted good, no 3000rpm limp nonsense, as my onboard turbo gauge reads 3000rpm I'm getting 9 psi boost and that's it, the EGR is mint clean smooth operation, the solenoid pushes back crossing terminals 1+5  with 12v power, maybe the intercooler crap I Gota check out, but I don't see oil seepage anywhere, as intercoolers to carry a little after a while..

 

Ohh bugger my beers getting warm...thx guys 

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Ohh btw, I bought the turbo assembly and a Sam from a dude in Toronto that has 3 cars, I paid $260cdn he's in magazines for show cars but doesn't know much about mechanical things, I took 1 of his smart 450 cdis out as he asked me to and holy hell, never been in a vehicle like that,  the bottom end torque was unreal, like a gocart, strait through exaust,and a map from Portugal ( where he's from) wow I want my sorry to be that nimble, actually pushed me into the seat, he has a full spare motor for sale on Kijiji right now, well a whole car really, - a turbo and Sam lol

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1 hour ago, Hobbitz said:

the wastegate/ actuator has the correct preload and is in mint condition

 

 

so you didnt drive it and adjust the actuator while observing map readings after you first installed it

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5 hours ago, LooseLugNuts said:

 

 

so you didnt drive it and adjust the actuator while observing map readings after you first installed it

The actuator arm is factory set, and still has the thread paint on each lock nut, as for observing map readings I don't have equipment for that, I have an obd2 reader can I use that?

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9 PSI @ 3000 RPM.  Is that with no load and car stationary?

 

Does engine start easily and is is idle even?

 

Look for leaks between turbo and inlet manifold.  Good idle and easy start would rule out any fuel or injector issue.  No need to concern yourself with MAP unless someone in the past has loaded a really bad MAP.

 

What is the history of htis Smart?  When did the problem first materialise and what were the circustances?

 

One more thing to rule out:  Confirm waste gate is not stuck open.  Move waste gate arm with a spanner and confirm it moves freely.

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Hi tolsen, she idles very smooth starts fine, under full load 4th gear let's say 3500-4000, barley at 80kph it's 9psi, as soon as I change to fith it starts to slow down and slowly stops spooling, I've had her for 3 years suddenly 2 years a go lost power, I had no time to look at her but I do now,

It's gets worse now, the low beams quit so I got another Sam for test drives at night, lights work fine now but there's that constant flashing key symbol now and the central locking doesn't work so I can't even start it or test drive it, think I'm gunna kill myself...lol

 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

The SAM and the key are coded to each other. If you just replace the SAM and try to use your origional key, it won't work. You will get the flashing key symbol and keyless entry will not work.   I would suggest inspecting your origional SAM for melted wires or bad solder connections on the headlight output. You can also add external relays to power the headlights.

You can teach your keys to the new SAM but you need to find someone with a MBSTAR program to do it.

Edited by Sydney
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57 minutes ago, Sydney said:

The SAM and the key are coded to each other. If you just replace the SAM and try to use your origional key, it won't work. You will get the flashing key symbol and keyless entry will not work.   I would suggest inspecting your origional SAM for melted wires or bad solder connections on the headlight output. You can also add external relays to power the headlights.

You can teach your keys to the new SAM but you need to find someone with a MBSTAR program to do it.

Agreed 100%....I have taught my new to me sam and speedo to talk to each other and the car by using my Star.....and it also required keys being retaught....all simplish stuff using a star machine.  Time consuming if you don't use it much like me but it's all possible. Worth the expense over trying to make another machine do MB related tasks when it's not designed to do so...imho.   IF you have the laptop already the star multiplexer and software isn't that  expensive to obtain. It's the laptop that hurts if you need to buy a good one. Like I chose to do.

I was going to suggest opening up your original SAM and checking the entire board for cold cracked solder joints. They can be very hard to see with the naked eye. I use that head magnifier set up with 3 lenses....works very well. You'll need a solder sucker and electronic solder not plumbing solder when you re-solder the board.  Also a good pin point soldering iron. I'm sure there is a video of someone doing it on youtube....lol.

I'll bet all your issues can be easily solved after researching each issue here or at Evilution's site.....there is a wealth of info between the two sites to help with almost every issue known to smarts.

 

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2 hours ago, Sydney said:

The SAM and the key are coded to each other. If you just replace the SAM and try to use your origional key, it won't work. You will get the flashing key symbol and keyless entry will not work.   I would suggest inspecting your origional SAM for melted wires or bad solder connections on the headlight output. You can also add external relays to power the headlights.

You can teach your keys to the new SAM but you need to find someone with a MBSTAR program to do it.

Your a life saver, thanks Sydney

 

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8 hours ago, Hobbitz said:

The actuator arm is factory set, and still has the thread paint on each lock nut, as for observing map readings I don't have equipment for that, I have an obd2 reader can I use that?

 

ah ok...for mine i only changed the turbo cartridge and had to redo all the actuator settings

 

obd2 reader only reads codes....you would need a scan tool that can access live data

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Ok so I desoldered the spare Sam and put the low beam relay into my one,( should work) now I'm gunna pull the intercooler and hopefully be relieved to see a hole or something, a friend has a spare but I might be able to repair it with marine apoxy or Ac Tig, guess we'll find out in about 4 hrs time.

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57 minutes ago, Hobbitz said:

Ok so I desoldered the spare Sam and put the low beam relay into my one,( should work) now I'm gunna pull the intercooler and hopefully be relieved to see a hole or something, a friend has a spare but I might be able to repair it with marine apoxy or Ac Tig, guess we'll find out in about 4 hrs time.

I'll bet it's too thin and hard to get at for a tig, but I have zero experience with a tig, just watched it used and it looked HOT...!....lol.
IF your marine epoxy  is similar to JBWeld then I expect it'll work well.....take the time to really make sure it's spotless inside and out....many cans of carb cleaner and varsol or gasoline worked for me, with acetone as the last shot....remove all fins off tubes also I used snips and a sharp blade to get the area smooth as possible to be able to clean it well.  It took a while, hours just to get it clean enough.

Good luck, oh also don't forget to trim the lower lip off the intake scoop even if it's not worn through it's just a matter of time before it happens.

 

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11 minutes ago, LooseLugNuts said:

a good welder can tig together pop cans

Lets hope he's a great welder then...lol...as the damage will be far worse than a simple rub through...lol.....like I said I have zero experience with a tig, the rest I can deal with with ease....lol  I even tried some of those brazing type rods for pop cans back in the day, nope couldn't get them to work, I think I may still have them...lol.   And NO, I'm not learning on an inter cooler...lol

 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

i tried those rods too...didnt work for me...i shake too much (and run out of patience) even stick welding is barely doable ...i can mig well though ...mig is very forgiving 

 

 

i remember using original gorilla glue to repair my intercooler ...and used some steel wood nails to take up the gap ...one of my most redneck achievements ever 

Edited by LooseLugNuts
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I can stick and mig, but mig is my best now.....I bought a professional welder which is capable of almost welding paper......but it also takes practice if you aren't doing it daily like I used to be.  The household machines are good but they won't have the fine enough settings to get you carefully down low, or high enough to get good solid penetration.
I still have the old dome top stick welder that farmers used to use back 50 years ago I bet.....it also hasn't been fired up in decades but I can't let it go, just in case. Wind is a mig's worse enemy unless using flux core wire, and that stuff will give you black lung in a heartbeat without a good mask. I carried a young kid to hospital who's one lung had collapsed and the other on it's way out back in the 90's....he nearly died.  He was lucky someone noticed him slumped over his work......a few more minutes and he'd be gone!

 

 

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1 hour ago, Willys said:

I'll bet it's too thin and hard to get at for a tig, but I have zero experience with a tig, just watched it used and it looked HOT...!....lol.
IF your marine epoxy  is similar to JBWeld then I expect it'll work well.....take the time to really make sure it's spotless inside and out....many cans of carb cleaner and varsol or gasoline worked for me, with acetone as the last shot....remove all fins off tubes also I used snips and a sharp blade to get the area smooth as possible to be able to clean it well.  It took a while, hours just to get it clean enough.

Good luck, oh also don't forget to trim the lower lip off the intake scoop even if it's not worn through it's just a matter of time before it happens.

 

Haha, it's not the intercooler,???? It's fine no holes no chaffing, pressure tested fine, I have no idea

 

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I weld pipe for all industries, but anyhow, I'm sooo frustrated, what could only make the turbo boost at 9psi max, the motor revs out, no smoke EGR is clean, injectors clean, air filters clean, exaust is new, turbo, wastegates new properly adjusted, clean fuel, what about fuel pump stuff now, or filters, I got 1 code saying glow plug, but it runs smooth, something is restricting it some where, it's doing my nut in, and I'm too broke to go to MB.

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A p0003 code popped up now, saying about low fuel ctr or something, I had a gut feeling something is happning with fuel, anyone had this code before and find the issue?

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