SnapDragon

06 Smart CDI Smoke while coasting

52 posts in this topic

Got the readings from the ECU through Eddy at Flying Tiger today. Gave me some great advice on the car and it was pretty cheap (40 CAD) to adjust the trans. Fuel pressures and boost pressure looked to be within spec (boost was 0.99 bar idle and 1.06 bar with a bit of pedal). When it came to check the selective quantity correction for each cylinder there was a small deviation from spec that Eddy pointed out might be leading to slightly stuck injectors. Injectors could be acting up which could have caused the smoke. Below is a picture of the readings.

 

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/17CzuVnE79znnTjegM6Rs1YV6MPVz99hr/view?usp=sharing

 

Can anyone else comment on these readings?

 

For the drive back and forth from Flying Tiger today amounting to around 60kms, I also changed my driving style from a early shifting (around 2500 rpms) to keep rpms low to letting the computer decide and driving with a heavier right foot (shifting at 3000 to 3500 rpm, put a smile on my face through the traffic). Result was no smoke from the back from any point during the drive. Perhaps my driving style is too gentle for the car. How do you guys usually drive the car in terms of gas pedal and shifting?

 

 

 

 

 

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I drive like an old lady most of the time simply to get the best possible fuel economy just to get a chuckle from the numbers.   I bet a good sonic cleaning would do those injectors a world of good.  Even a set of new nozzles if they keep acting up.
I shift at or around 2500 and shift down when the car wants to.....no pounding or working of the clutch system so to speak......nice and easy does it....no smoke at all and my CAT has been removed.  Maybe that is it...maybe your CAT is getting plugged up? Then all of a sudden it releases the crap and you get the smoke?

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1 hour ago, Willys said:

I drive like an old lady most of the time simply to get the best possible fuel economy just to get a chuckle from the numbers.   I bet a good sonic cleaning would do those injectors a world of good.  Even a set of new nozzles if they keep acting up.
I shift at or around 2500 and shift down when the car wants to.....no pounding or working of the clutch system so to speak......nice and easy does it....no smoke at all and my CAT has been removed.  Maybe that is it...maybe your CAT is getting plugged up? Then all of a sudden it releases the crap and you get the smoke?

 

CAT as in catalytic converter as in the basically the big exhaust muffler thingy that makes up basically the entire exhaust? I have another I can swap in. I did the sonic cleaning to the injectors when doing the oil gear pump job 400km ago so many new tips are in order. 

 

Still gotta clean the EGR again though and think about that blocking plate.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Spend on a Stickman007 emulator to get rid of the EGR all together if you can afford, I have 2 and not an issue with either of them. You use a piece of exhaust tubing in place of EGR and a blocking plate  and Bob's your uncle, job done. OR you can clean the EGR to like new condition then turn cylinder 180 degree I think it is and also use blocking plate....and leave it connected into the electronics of car and see if that works?  You'll need to research the procedure completely as I don't know enough about it to say if it's the best way or not...sorry.  It's the free way basically and the car thinks everything is OK and continues on......you decide....?
Yes the CAT is what you said, I cut them out and reweld the can back up, but it's very thin material and there is 3 layers to deal with. Your welder needs to be able to be turned down way low to be able to not burn through while welding. It's paper thin.  I seem to think you get better flow without the CAT, but it will smell while sitting at a red light when the wind is just right. Not bad just a diesel smell is all. Once driving it goes away.  Again your choice...

 

Also buy new crush washers to put under injectors, they are a one time use item, so to speak. Unless you re-aneal them...

 

Edited by Willys
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I shift mine at 4400 RPM when accelerating hard (Eddy remapped) and keep RPM around 2200 for normal driving at cruising speed.  If accelerating more gently, I shift at about 3600 RPM.  I can pussyfoot too but that's no fun.  Lifetime FE with this remapped car is in my signature: 4.2 L/100 and the non-remapped one I had before that I drove more gently had a lifetime average of 3.95 L/100 km.  Both cars rode on 175 front and 195 rear tires.

 

When downshifting with the paddles or stick I always give the fuel pedal some travel, which makes the engine computer rev-match and totally stops clutch disc wear when gearing down.  It's a not too commonly known built in feature of the car.  Unlike old school manuals, you don't have to actually match the revs - the computer does it for you.  You can even do this with the car in "softouch" automatic mode.

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I forgot to mention: about catalysts.  I had 247,274 km on my first diesel when it was killed from the rear by a Pontiac but it had the original cat all its life and there were no problems. 

 

On the Canada 1, I got a BRABUS SS exhaust for a diesel from a former member here with the handle Gent and it had rattled itself apart inside due to a missing vibration balancer.  But it was made from excellent quality stainless steel and it was worth it to me to have it cut open and repaired by a pro.  I told him to remove the cat if it looked bad but it was intact and he left it.  The catalyst takes up only about 10% of the length of the unit - most of it is a resonating chamber.

 

And..since 2013 when it was installed...it has been fine for 120,000 km.

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Hmmmm....while repairing these exhausts now for a while I have seen plenty of coked up exhausts that require plenty of banging to just get it clean enough to be able to be welded without gobs of soot contaminating the welding area. The very fine honey comb construction is ideal for it to become plugged up   I just go by what I actually see when opening them up to clear the rust away to be able to weld them.  Some are clean and more than not operate as they are designed to do. But if you are having issues with performance or smokey exhaust issues, I'd be wondering IF this might be a reason why?  These exhausts are a very simple thing with barely any muffler at all in them at all, maybe 10 inches. The CAT is about 6 inches in length. So the remaining length is just an open chamber between the two and before the CAT. After all it's not a high performance machine that is dialed in with in an inch of it's life...lol

As for flogging an engine, it's perfectly fine to do so IF it has been flogged it's entire lifespan and not babied prior to you flogging it as it will have worn in to a specific location etc. If you flog an engine that has been babied you are asking for trouble IMHO. So, it's up to you to follow someone's advise who has operated his engine since day one so to speak in this way and you have just bought a car and you know nothing about it's past history.....unless you like spending on engine repairs or buying old cars frequently...?   I used to flog all my cars from new also when I was younger, yes plenty of fun. I have also flogged plenty as used cars and I'll bet it shortened their usefulness or lifespan as a used car. But back then I didn't care about how long they lasted, just beat them till they gave in. My driving style now has changed drastically, I find it a challenge to use as little fuel as possible just to laugh when it comes time to refuel.  It's the small things that make me laugh now....lol. Re-fueling is one of those things. I still drive 10 or so over the limit, I just take my time getting there.   To each their own....it's your wallet after all.

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There is no rust in a BRABUS can, they're 100% SS.  Yes they can get sooty inside but in 410,000 km of smart cdi motoring I've never had to think about an exhaust system.  Still have the original one too, with 35,000 original km on it, as a reserve should the BRABUS one ever need another repair.. 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Welp, checked the muffler and found it was caked in black soot, moved onto the turbo and found a little bit of oil on the intake side which I suppose is normal from the CCV? Below is a picture of the oil.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/17s7vfYemGZ3jy8Dr-f2Tq1lCc3vRW3dw/view?usp=sharing

 

I then took off the turbo and inspected the exhaust side and found that it was nice and dry. I then proceeded to take the intercooler out which was coated with oil. That was PITA. I then found an infamous problem. You can probably guess this. Heres a picture.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/17seWpUYPnJCdJ6jXvGZxn-ln-QFAg2re/view?usp=sharing

 

Whats more interesting are these notches that I have not seen before on the internet. Another picture.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/17tfdG3NCT2Or-wq6-PuzY9_ohFEegXWE/view?usp=sharing

 

I can only conclude that the plastic wearing into this intercooler formed a good enough seal for most driving but when going up a hill, the increased pressure in the intake piping must have let air escape through these cuts. Could that then cause a rich mix situation causing grey and black smoke out the back?

 

Oil consumption is also very bad. Do not know how this could be caused.

 

I suppose a new intercooler is in order. Lets hope its not too much. Anyone got a recommendation to get one of these? 

 

 

 

Edited by SnapDragon

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IF, you wish to spend hours/days repairing that inter-cooler it's possible and it will last a while, not as long as a new one but the fix is cheap money wise.  I have repaired 3 so far, one had signs of those side rubs but at the time I never thought much about them. Seems they can be a real issue.  Cleaning and prepping the tubes for a many layered repair using the liquid runnier quick drying JB-Weld is the hard part and depending upon your time allowed possibly more than you want to spend over opening your wallet. A new inter-cooler in North America is far more expensive I think than what is shown above, but hey, it's quick and easy. To prep the inter-cooler you need to carefully cut away the tube fins around the tubes that are damaged using a razor knife/exacto knife. Then wash all oil and it's residue out and off the inter-cooler inside and out. Gasoline seems to work the best to get the worst off then it's varsol then acetone. Then a slow build up of the magical JB-Weld until you have a complete seal around all surfaces of each damaged tube.  I buy the 5 minute or fast drying JB-Weld and keep applying as I can ....as I have said it takes time but JB-Weld is basically free compared to buying a new inter-cooler.   Your choice....I have a repaired  one in the beater and a brand new one in my good car, simply because I found it at the scrapyard in a wreck!  Cost me $50..!!!  They didn't know what they were worth at the time.   Next is the job of cutting down the lower lip of the shroud to prevent it happening again and also tightening up the side clamps to keep it a tight fit. OR zip tie it in as tight as you can get it.
I haven't had any issues with any repaired version I have done or heard of one leaking again. So it does work.  Looks bad compared to a new one I agree, but it works and doesn't throw a code so that also proves it's still working correctly.

To each their own....once again.

 

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I got a free new intercooler on my first smart at 200,000 km and age 7 - courtesy repair by the dealer in Victoria.  If you're the original owner, it would not hurt to ask...though the answer is likely "no".

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MikeT unfortunately I am not the original owner so that's kinda out of the question.

 

Did smart ever update the design on the cradle for this intercooler to eliminate the cutting issue? Just trying to see if there is any point in finding one at a junk yard. If not, I think I will try and repair the tubes. Something like putting a little metal cast on each of the cuts and gluing on top is something I want to try.

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Posted (edited) · Report post

I intend to do something like this to repair the radiator. Made a little aluminum cover to place over the hole and then I will JB weld it in. Anyone think there is any issues? Picture below.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/18Ra1QG70OCfIT3oFbcuNtYGtnkSGUhSZ/view?usp=sharing

 

After further examination, I see there is another layer of metal that is damaged underneath the worn out layer and I was wondering if that really needs to be repaired as well? The previous picture should show what I mean.

 

 

Edited by SnapDragon

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7 minutes ago, SnapDragon said:

I intend to do something like this to repair the radiator. Made a little aluminum cover to place over the hole and then I will JB weld it in. Anyone think there is any issues? Picture below.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/18Ra1QG70OCfIT3oFbcuNtYGtnkSGUhSZ/view?usp=sharing

 

After further examination, I see there is another layer of metal that is damaged underneath the worn out layer and I was wondering if that really needs to be repaired as well? The previous picture should show what I mean.

 

 

OK, think about it, this has to be air tight. Placing that patch over the hole is fine but how will it seal the hole completely? It requires some sort of goo to hold it down or seal the hole. Better to simply cut the fins off the tubes, clean like new, then carefully build up the JB-Weld in layers until it's completely covering the holes. Then if you choose you can glue a plate over the repair.
You must trim the scoop and no I don't think they changed the design from what i have seen so far..? I stand the cooler upright at first to allow the stuff to seep onto the bottom of where the tubes go into the tank. Then once that is well and truly hard I slowly work it up and over the damaged area. It'll look like crap, but it will work. The solid JB-Weld won't stick well enough to the tubes, ask me how I know. You need the flowing ability of the liquid type to get it to adhere to the tubes and base to create a base to work from.  Like I said it'll take a few days to get it done and many different positions to hold it in or you can keep holding it and rotating it to allow it to seal and then get hard enough to stop it seeping or falling off,dripping.  I don't think I have any pics of mine but maybe on another thread about this topic?  Sorry can't remember. Those tubes are a single tube running from front to back, not many joined together like in a radiator. So plugging up a small amount of them to get a good seal is OK I have found. Best to leave any metal in the damaged tubes to help stop the liquid flowing into them.  Once you get into it you'll see what I'm trying to say. I'm almost certain the dollar store crap 2 part epoxy would work but wouldn't bet my life on it. Also if you had a small thin piece of metal to fill the gap to help stop the flow into the tube maybe that would help, then somehow cut it off ready for the next layer...?  It just must be 10000% clean and I scratch the surfaces up using a knife just a bit to give the JB-Weld something to adhere to. Just a bit.

Good luck.

 

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Yes Smart did change design of intercooler support cradle. They removed 6 mm from lower horizontal part of cradle, the part of cradle that cuts into intercooler.

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mine looked worse

 

i "fixed" it with gorilla glue...the amber kind....and some finishing nails because the glue was falling thru the holes too easy lol ...sounds redneck but it worked for years...and is still working for the current owner as far as i know

 

oh and i definitely cut some plastic off so it didnt wear thru again

 

i like to try the cheap way first

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Man you really need an arts and crafts degree and a pretty committed hobbyist at repairing cars to own a smart CDI. I have cut the plastic a bit and now am in the process of gluing the intercooler. I will post an update upon completion of the repair and see if this fixes the original problem I posted on. 

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7 hours ago, SnapDragon said:

Did smart ever update the design on the cradle for this intercooler to eliminate the cutting issue?

 

The word on the street back then was that the later cars - whatever that means - had redesigned holders that didn't chafe the IC.  However, my Canada 1 BRABUS was made in Spring 2006 and was a few months from the end of production and it too wore a hole through the IC. 

 

I think there was a service bulletin and it described how to trim the plastic holder.  Whether a new holder was ever designed or not, I'm not sure, but if it was, it was after production ended.

 

I paid the dealer $550 to do that job for me on the second car (which I bought used in Toronto in 2010).

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I believe the modified intercooler support cradle appeared in 2006.

B3C0BC1E-FFA2-4B64-A2D7-78A45429DF1C.jpeg

Regrettably they did not beef up lower part of the sides to compensate for no longer any support provided by lower horizontal part. 

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I ended up sourcing a used intercooler from Eddy that only had a pinhole in 1 of the tubes. Slathered that thing with JB weld and placed some brake pad bracket metal on top to protect it should anymore chaffing occur. I also ensured the fit between the plastic cradle and intercooler was tight with no room to moved against each other. Put everything together and also replaced the muffler with a spare as the original was caked in black soot. The car seems to have gained 30% of its power and the oil leak the covered the transmission also seems to have stopped. But holy crap this thing really flies with no holes in the intercooler. Makes me want to upload a tune hehehe. The car hasn’t smoked since the repair and I will post here if the problem comes back again. Thank you everyone for your input. 

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Posted (edited) · Report post

Get the remap!  No regrets.  At least one smart cdi ran to over 300K km with an Eddy remap before it was written off in a collision.  I aim to be another with the Canada 1.

Edited by MikeT
typo

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18 hours ago, SnapDragon said:

 The car seems to have gained 30% of its power and the oil leak the covered the transmission also seems to have stopped. 

the oil problem is still there,  you just stopped the leak by fixing the hole in the intercooler.   

i assume now the oil will just collect in the intercooler,  some of it might get sucked back into the combustion chamber and burnt off.

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im pretty sure its normal to have oil in the intercooler

 

every one ive ever pulled apart had oil....

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14 hours ago, Sydney said:

the oil problem is still there,  you just stopped the leak by fixing the hole in the intercooler.   

i assume now the oil will just collect in the intercooler,  some of it might get sucked back into the combustion chamber and burnt off.

If our intercoolers are not supposed to be a little wet from oil then there is only two places it can come from right? The CCV from the cam cover into the TIK which could have somehow started delivering fluid instead of fumes, or the turbo intake side leaking through the shaft? Turbo was replaced around 400km ago with a Chinese part that has worked very well. Last I inspected it the exhaust side was dry and the intake had a bit of oil sitting there before the air reaches the turbine (picture in post #34). Maybe that oil sitting there is a product of the CCV pushing out fluid oil? Gahh my moment of bliss with a working smart is gone again.

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