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@  FlossyTheSmart : (19 November 2014 - 11:38 AM) classic
@  Mike T : (19 November 2014 - 11:38 AM) Hodor
@  evotell : (19 November 2014 - 11:35 AM) Saying your own name, I don't get it?
@  dmoonen : (19 November 2014 - 10:52 AM) Saying your own name evotell :P
@  evotell : (19 November 2014 - 10:49 AM) evotell
@  KurtMan : (18 November 2014 - 06:29 PM) Well, we repaired the wires and its driving fine now... I guess I'll have to wait for another slushy day to be sure. Thanks for all the help guys!
@  Mike T : (18 November 2014 - 05:24 PM) This happened to our dearly departed green car too and the solution was that simple.
@  SkydiverChris : (18 November 2014 - 03:32 PM) Glad to hear that you may have found the cause Kurt! Keep us posted! It's almost never that simple.
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 12:00 PM) cost me close to $300 to tow from the Canadian border post at Hemingford to my driveway (80 km), and my car was up on blocks for two weeks while I tracked down and resolved the issues.
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 11:58 AM) jurist? During
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 11:58 AM) Yep, mine started acting up jurist a January thaw on a long steady drive through the country, then the car refused to move on a slushy day on a long steady drive on the same roads a week later. The slushy brine is both conductive and tenacious.
@  FlossyTheSmart : (18 November 2014 - 11:40 AM) That's probably it.
@  KurtMan : (18 November 2014 - 11:21 AM) So my friend with soldering skills is going to help me after work... I'm confident this will solve the problem. First slushy day we have so it must have splashed up there and shorted out.
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 10:25 AM) knock on wood, no recurrence after two winters and three summers.
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 10:25 AM) then wraped all in Tesa cloth harness tape ($20 a roll at MB, about the same off ebay)
@  Francesco : (18 November 2014 - 10:24 AM) Yeah, mine was the same. I repaired the wires and coated the whole thing in Liquid Electrical Tape ($9 at CT)
@  stickman007 : (18 November 2014 - 10:20 AM) There's probably corrosion inside the sheath due to moisture getting in
@  FlossyTheSmart : (18 November 2014 - 07:29 AM) with the wires chafed, they're probably only intermittantly making good contact. Wrapping in electrical tape probably won't be able to keep the connection good.
@  KurtMan : (18 November 2014 - 07:26 AM) What if I wrap the chafed wires in electrical tape and try driving around?
@  FlossyTheSmart : (18 November 2014 - 07:21 AM) hopefully it's as simple as that!
@  KurtMan : (18 November 2014 - 07:11 AM) I immediately found 2 chafed wires at the connection to the clutch actuator!
@  dmoonen : (18 November 2014 - 05:49 AM) Majority of the problems are in the engine harness area right at the IC scoop. Removing the IC would give you more wiggle room and less curse words
@  dmoonen : (18 November 2014 - 05:47 AM) SAM to rear ecu travels under the carpet and right into the firewall behind the seats.
@  dmoonen : (18 November 2014 - 05:46 AM) Harness to two sections: 1:Rear ECU TO engine sensors and components. 2: Sam:Rear ECU.
@  dmoonen : (18 November 2014 - 05:44 AM) No you dont need to kurt, mainly around the intercooler scoop area and back youll be
@  KurtMan : (18 November 2014 - 04:27 AM) Do I have to remove any of the under panels to get to the harness?
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 04:33 PM) Well maybe if I need a star machine I'll send you a message Max!
@  FlossyTheSmart : (17 November 2014 - 04:20 PM) I think just me, Chris, and Troy have star machines in the Ottawa area.
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 04:03 PM) Any help would be appreciated!
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:58 PM) NOt sure if anyone out your way has a Star, but there are a couple people around Ottawa that do. If you're stuck, they may be able to help
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:56 PM) Thanks I appreciate it!
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:55 PM) Sorry man, if you're still stuck on the weekend, I might be convinced to make a trip out that way (unless someone else gets there before I do), but there's a tonne of stuff to try, and the Star may or may not give you something to go on.
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:49 PM) Ya I feel ya... I guess I'll check the fork and harness tomorrow and go from there. Wish me luck!
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:46 PM) Ewww...that's one hell of a trip. haha
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:42 PM) Innes/Tenth line exactly
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:42 PM) If it was summer, I skydive in Gatineau and am out that way almost every weekend. Unfortunately, we don't jump in winter much.
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:40 PM) I'm actually out 15 minutes west of Carleton Place, so it's a bit of a trek. Are you like "Innes/10th Line" east, or like, St Laurent East?
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:39 PM) More here too: http://www.fq101.co....the-3-bars.html
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:38 PM) What would it take to get you to venture out of your comfort zone? lol
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:38 PM) I work in Bells corners, so I'm there daily. ALso, here's a good start to the "What might it be question" http://www.evilution.co.uk/168
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:37 PM) Damn, I was gonna say that I can bring my Star computer and we can check it out, but I haven't been to the east end in years/
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:36 PM) Dangit! East-end unfortunately!
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:35 PM) I dont suppose you're in the west end are you?
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:21 PM) BTW thanks Chris for your quick response!
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:20 PM) I guess I'll put it in the garage and attempt to pull the wiring harness out tomorrow. Anyone know where there is a detailed thread of how to do that?
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 03:19 PM) Traction control and CE light came on so I pulled over and switched into neutral and got the 3 bars. It managed to to go back into gear and I drove a kilometer to my wife's house where it sits now...
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:00 PM) here's a start: http://www.smartcaro...02-450-a-48014/
@  SkydiverChris : (17 November 2014 - 03:00 PM) If that's not the code from a Star computer, I've found that the codes from other computers are often misleading.
@  KurtMan : (17 November 2014 - 02:57 PM) I just got the P0702 code :help:
@  FlossyTheSmart : (17 November 2014 - 09:28 AM) those are the closest places that we are aware of.

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18 replies to this topic

#1 fortow

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Posted 22 August 2008 - 07:19 PM

I recently bought a Passion 2008.The manual seems to be written for a different model. The 'driver information center' is different from the description in the manual. Clock setting, and other settings do not operate as described. Is this a problem with the manuals for the new cars? They say the car shouldn't be towed for long distances but that information is known to be incorrect - I have a letter from Mercedes stating that the car can be towed 4 wheels down with no reservations. It mentions that the key should be in position '0" though, but that is not possible. When the car is put into neutral the key will not turn back to the '0' position. Power is also not shut down so the battery will deplete. Anyone with information on this?How do I adjust the clock? Is there a service interval mode? If so how is it reset? Even resetting the trip meter is not described and, I only got it to work once. The two push buttons on either side of the display don't seem to control anything no matter how long they're depressed, or in what order, or number of pushes. What gives?Can I rely on other information in the manual such as technical specs, lug nut torque for example? (110 NM)Is there a jack specifically designed for this car?

Edited by fortow, 22 August 2008 - 11:17 PM.


#2 fortow

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Posted 23 August 2008 - 09:37 AM

Anyone with any information at all about how to set-reset the clock, service interval etc?People are reading the question but not responding - is it because no one else has come across this problem yet on the new cars?

#3 bilgladstone

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Posted 23 August 2008 - 09:58 AM

I read your post but have no idea whether any of the procedures are the same on your W451 as for myW450! Sorry :dunno:Bil :sun:

Edited by bilgladstone, 23 August 2008 - 09:58 AM.

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#4 SmartieParts

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Posted 23 August 2008 - 10:00 AM

About your towing statement. Other than you saying it, I have not read anywhere that you can tow 4 wheels down on the new smart. I'm not sure where you got that information, but all indications have been to the contrary.As for the other information in the manual... it is rare for a document to be perfect, but it is probably pretty good. Should you "rely" on it? Well, it isn't a service manual if that's what you're asking. Take a look at the fuses page, for example - it only goes up to #20 (or something like that) but there's a lot more fuses than that! (whatever the last one in the manual is... the very next one is the cigarette lighter in case anyone needs to know that :))Something you MUST keep in mind is that the smart shifter is different for North American cars than it is for European ones. There is no "N" or "P" in the original design of the car, so if it says you must have the key in zero, and you figure (logically) that your car must be in "N" while being towed, and you physically can't achieve both at the same time... to me that would mean the car can't be towed as you want. Well, at least not without some creative modification :)Adjusting the clock is pretty straight forward. Going off memory here: push the right button and hold it down till things start blinking. Then use the left and right buttons to make the adjustments as necessary.Resetting a service interval indicator is a dealer-secret :) Someone will figure it out and post eventually, but they want you to bring the car to them. The indicator isn't a reminder for you to service your car - its a reminder for you to pay more money to the dealership.Resetting the trip is also straight forward. Push the left button and hold it until it blinks, then clears, the trip. Not sure if its in the manual or not but it seemed obvious and worked the first (and every) time I did it.Specific jack? I doubt it. I don't have the manual handy and I often get confused between what was in which manual (I owned the 450 as well) but I know at least one of them had it in there under Jacking Points. But on your hands and knees it should be obvious too... look for steel instead of plastic somewhat close to, and probably on the inside of, the front and rear wheels. I should know this as I've had it up many times... but I work on various cars and I can't remember for some reason exactly where they are. But I certainly didn't use any special jack to do it. - Steven
2008 Passion Coupe
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Factory options: Alarm system and fog lights.
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#5 bilgladstone

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Posted 23 August 2008 - 10:14 AM

Re: service interval indicator... does the car's computer keep a record of at what mileage the indicator is reset? I make sure to reset my 450 whenever I do my own service because I figure the record of that mileage/reset will show up in the dealer's Star system and so indicate to them (in addition to my paper records) that I am doing the required maintenance.B :sun:
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#6 fortow

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Posted 23 August 2008 - 08:45 PM

Thanks for the replies. Apparently the procedures are different for the 451, or there's simply something different about my car. My manual refers to procedures and shows pictures of things that are not applicable to my car - for instance, procedures for adjusting settings in the 'Multifunction Display' do not work as described, the drawings and photographs of the display are different, the pictures of the shift lever consol are different, the description of how to start the engine and to shift gears is not applicable, and more. The new manual also doesn't state that the car is towable 4 down but I have a letter from Mercedes stating that it is now designed to be towed (the transmission has been redesigned specifically for that purpose). I'm stumped as to how to reset the time on the clock in the display. There is also no indication of any 'Service Interval Indicator' nor any way to access it and no means of changing it. Pressing the buttons on the Multi-function Display does not switch on the various indicators as stated. Otherwise, most other descriptions, drawings, photographs do represent the vehicle I own. Obviously there have been changes to the vehicle that have not been documented in the manuals delivered with new cars. I have not as yet approached the dealer with this issue hoping that someone could shed some light on the subject before I spoke with them. SmartieParts - I have a letter stating that the new car can be towed four wheels down. This has also been a discussion on the SCoA forums. The following thread is one of the discussions on that topic. Smart Car towing . Also - Flat towing . Although there has been considerable confusion about towing, the latest information, and assurances I have been given personally are that it indeed can be flat towed. Thanks for the descriptions for adjustments - but no matter how I try they don't work. Holding down the right button occasionally results in a blinking clock reading but most of the time it won't. By the way, all the figures flash, not just the colon as described in the manual. Also, when I have achieved a blinking clock reading, pushing either the right or left button to adjust the time simply changes the reading back to steady again with no adjustment of the time. I did get the trip to reset only once, subsequently it has refused to cooperate. There is an explanation as to the procedure for resetting the Service Interval on Evilution's website (from SCoA) - but neither of the two explanations seem to work. However, when attempting to do this I was working by memory of the procedure. On another matter, but equally as frustrating, opening the upper section of the tailgate by grabbing the handle of the tailgate sometimes results in opening the upper glass section but most of the time it will not unlock by this method. Perhaps there is a problem with my car, and perhaps there have been changes that are not yet documented. My car may be one of the later builds with differences, I don't know. Has anyone else come across this as well?

Edited by fortow, 23 August 2008 - 09:11 PM.


#7 Nextourer

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Posted 24 August 2008 - 01:23 PM

ok either your manual somehow was mixed with another car's manual (maybe you got a European manual by accident??) or you're not understanding the words correctly.The service interval indicator will be shown if you repeatedly press the left button. It will show up where the Trip Odo is and will show you a spanner (or two depending on whether your next service is an A or B) and the number of kms left to the next service.Steve's correct with regards to the clock and resetting the Trip Odo, both of which are mentioned in the manual.
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#8 fortow

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Posted 24 August 2008 - 06:45 PM

ok either your manual somehow was mixed with another car's manual (maybe you got a European manual by accident??) or you're not understanding the words correctly. The service interval indicator will be shown if you repeatedly press the left button. It will show up where the Trip Odo is and will show you a spanner (or two depending on whether your next service is an A or B) and the number of kms left to the next service. Steve's correct with regards to the clock and resetting the Trip Odo, both of which are mentioned in the manual.

Nope - neither of those work as described. Repeatedly pressing the left button does nothing at all. The clock and trip meter setting behaves as I described. If all the new cars should operate as has been discussed here, then there is a problem with my display. I'll see the dealer tomorrow about this. I'd still like to hear from anyone who has experienced similar difficulties though. There is one other matter that may or may not be normal behaviour - it wanders on the highway both when exposed to strong side winds which is understandable, but also there is considerable deflection due to grooves worn in the roadway from heavy traffic - this is usually referred to as trammeling. If all Smart cars behave in this way then an alignment won't be called for but if that behaviour is not common then perhaps it should be re-aligned. Comments?

#9 yolanda

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Posted 24 August 2008 - 07:38 PM

trammeling. If all Smart cars behave in this way then an alignment won't be called for but if that behaviour is not common then perhaps it should be re-aligned. Comments?

Sadly, yes, smart cars do this. The wheel base is just a bit narrower than normal so you wind up not quite setting in the ruts. The solution is to straddle them with your driving, so that you have one wheel on the hump in the middle and one near the edge of the lane, whichever is a safer choice.
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#10 Mike T

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Posted 24 August 2008 - 07:55 PM

I have never noticed a tendency for tramlining on dry roads, rutted by trucks or not. Mind you, mine is running 175/195 tires.

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#11 Nextourer

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Posted 24 August 2008 - 09:07 PM

Nope - neither of those work as described. Repeatedly pressing the left button does nothing at all. The clock and trip meter setting behaves as I described. If all the new cars should operate as has been discussed here, then there is a problem with my display. I'll see the dealer tomorrow about this. I'd still like to hear from anyone who has experienced similar difficulties though.

ehh? ok... hmm... and we're assuming you're from North America?
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#12 denisjolicoeur

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 06:28 AM

Resetting a service interval indicator is a dealer-secret :) Someone will figure it out and post eventually, but they want you to bring the car to them. The indicator isn't a reminder for you to service your car - its a reminder for you to pay more money to the dealership.

Switch on the ignition to position 1

Select maintenance indicator within 4 sec by double tapping the instrument cluster button

Switch of the ignition to position 0 (off) within 10 sec

Push and hold in the instrument cluster button and switch ignition on

Hold the instrument cluster button for another 10sec

In that time, the spanner symbol on the LCD will flash and eventually reset

PS. For those that didn't know, you can access the service interval indicator at any time to see how long until your next service is due simply by double-tapping the left cluster button.

Edited by denisjolicoeur, 25 August 2008 - 06:34 AM.

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#13 denisjolicoeur

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 06:40 AM

On another matter, but equally as frustrating, opening the upper section of the tailgate by grabbing the handle of the tailgate sometimes results in opening the upper glass section but most of the time it will not unlock by this method.

The car must be fully unlocked first for this to work, hit the unlock button twice on the remote or hit the unlock button on the dash before trying this switch. As for all of your problems with the cluster buttons, it sounds like they sometimes work for you but not always. The buttons are probably just stiff, they'll loosen with time and use! Be more firm, press harder to ensure contact.
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#14 fortow

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 10:24 AM

Once again, thanks for the replies, suggestions, and advice.However, as I've been trying to convey, pushing the buttons as has been described does not work. In fact it does nothing except that very occasionally holding the right button will make the clock display flash then touching either the left or right button to adjust the time will instead just stop it from flashing with no change in clock setting - also, the left button did allow me to reset the trip odometer once, but has refused to do so again. Double tapping the left button does nothing and any attempt to access the service interval display does not work.I wanted to know if anyone else has this same problem - and would also like to know if all the manuals for the new cars illustrate display panels that are not installed on the cars as well as shift levers/consols and directions for shifting that do not apply to the car.The other issue is regarding opening the upper rear gate - I am fully aware that the vehicle must be unlocked hitting the button twice. Nontheless, it works sometimes and sometimes it does not.Just to be certain, I will try once again before confronting the dealer on these issues.Also, I live in Canada, purchased a Smart Passion, 2008. The directions I've read are clear but following them does not achieve the desired result. Is my car the only one that behaves like this?

#15 SmartieParts

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 11:23 AM

Yes, we understand what you are saying. So why don't you just assume that no... nobody else is having the same problem... and move forward? I don't get why you are waiting for someone else with the same problem? Its not like you get a discount for bringing a buddy in with you to the dealer. :)The first (and subsequent) responses have been to confirm you understand the procedures. You do, so that leaves pretty much the other conclusion... warranty time. There, either the dealer will fix it, or demonstrate that you weren't doing it properly, whichever the case may indeed be.And again, the manuals aren't perfect. Question... do you find wording in your manual that makes specific statements for US vs Canadian cars? In particular, look for the headlight section regarding daytime running lights. If it does not, then perhaps you have a European manual for some strange reason.Also find a date of publishing or an image of something that confirms you have a manual for the 451. Is it possible you have a 450 manual somehow? - Steven
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Mods: Cruise Contol


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#16 Jibber

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 01:16 PM

Sadly, yes, smart cars do this. The wheel base is just a bit narrower than normal so you wind up not quite setting in the ruts. The solution is to straddle them with your driving, so that you have one wheel on the hump in the middle and one near the edge of the lane, whichever is a safer choice.

Driving like this will also net you better fuel mileage when you don't have to spend all that extra energy plowing through puddles ;) Also, when I got my hands on the Euro-spec 451 that was being shown at Lone Star Mercedes back in the winter, I touched everything I could (since I couldn't drive it anywhere :P) The two triangular buttons infront of the instrument cluster on either side of the steering column housing work exactly the same way as they do on my USDM-spec 451 that I picked up in May. My guess is there is something wrong with those buttons. Bring it to your MB dealership to have it checked out, and if there is no fault found, have the tech from service show you through the operation of your buttons. Sometimes salesman aren't quite as well-versed in the intricate details as we'd like them to be ;) If you're in or around the Calgary area, I definately don't mind stopping by to see if they're operating properly. Just shoot me a PM if you want to meet up. That would at least save you a trip to the dealership :) EDIT : for clarity

Edited by Jibber, 25 August 2008 - 04:36 PM.

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#17 Nextourer

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 03:47 PM

Once again, thanks for the replies, suggestions, and advice.

However, as I've been trying to convey, pushing the buttons as has been described does not work. In fact it does nothing except that very occasionally holding the right button will make the clock display flash then touching either the left or right button to adjust the time will instead just stop it from flashing with no change in clock setting - also, the left button did allow me to reset the trip odometer once, but has refused to do so again. Double tapping the left button does nothing and any attempt to access the service interval display does not work.

I wanted to know if anyone else has this same problem - and would also like to know if all the manuals for the new cars illustrate display panels that are not installed on the cars as well as shift levers/consols and directions for shifting that do not apply to the car.
The other issue is regarding opening the upper rear gate - I am fully aware that the vehicle must be unlocked hitting the button twice. Nontheless, it works sometimes and sometimes it does not.

Just to be certain, I will try once again before confronting the dealer on these issues.

Also, I live in Canada, purchased a Smart Passion, 2008.
The directions I've read are clear but following them does not achieve the desired result. Is my car the only one that behaves like this?

okok now we have some things cleared up. So it has worked before, but now has failed to work. In that case, why don't you just bring it in to the dealer. It's now pretty plausible that the buttons aren't working as designed.
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#18 fortow

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:18 PM

okok now we have some things cleared up. So it has worked before, but now has failed to work. In that case, why don't you just bring it in to the dealer. It's now pretty plausible that the buttons aren't working as designed.


No, it actually never worked properly, as I mentioned.

This was confirmed by having a Mercedes tech look at it. There is a problem with the circuit board.
Actually, before taking to the dealer, I pressed very hard on the buttons to the point where the presure was painful. It began to work then and I was able to set the time and the maintenance interval. However, it still does not respond as it should. The tech let me try another car they had on the lot and the buttons responded immediately with little pressure.

I will be setting up an appointment to get this issue resolved.

Thanks everyone for your helpful comments.

On the other matter of the manual not representing the car - does anyone have any comments regarding that?

#19 denisjolicoeur

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:46 PM

On the other matter of the manual not representing the car - does anyone have any comments regarding that?

Mine was extremely vague as well (at the very beginning of the 451 production). Some information was clearly just for either U.S. or Euro cars, not specific to the Canadian models. I just assumed that there was just one manual for all versions; whether Euro or North American. I didn't like it but I still managed to figure out what I needed from it and left it at that. I was having too much fun with the car to let vague literature bother me!

Edited by denisjolicoeur, 26 August 2008 - 12:49 PM.

2008 smart fortwo Passion Coupe 451.




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