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@  smart65 : (21 May 2015 - 11:57 AM) Thanks
@  FlossyTheSmart : (21 May 2015 - 06:48 AM) You can now also click on the number of comments and it will take you to the shop page with the comments on it
@  FlossyTheSmart : (21 May 2015 - 06:36 AM) If you click on the shop name, it will take you to a page just for that shop, with the full details. I'll make the comment count a link to the page as well.
@  smart65 : (21 May 2015 - 06:28 AM) How can comments be accessed in Service Options?
@  Mike T : (20 May 2015 - 11:39 AM) PM sent of manual excerpt
@  Mike T : (20 May 2015 - 11:37 AM) It's in the owners manual all right
@  Huronlad : (20 May 2015 - 08:47 AM) There are numerous threads about the "three bars of death", make use of the forum search feature and do some reading.
@  1EGRBVR : (20 May 2015 - 06:39 AM) Thanks. I see nothing in the owners manual.
@  Mike T : (20 May 2015 - 06:31 AM) *Check
@  Mike T : (20 May 2015 - 06:31 AM) Gheck your owners manual, it is a gearbox fault.
@  1EGRBVR : (20 May 2015 - 06:07 AM) On the instrument cluster where the LED shows the gear you are in or A for Automatic, I am showing 3 vertical lines instead going across.  Has anyone else encountered this?   This happened after I changed the rear signal light.
@  Mike T : (19 May 2015 - 08:13 PM) Le Club 404 and some private sector guys in Europe are picking up on this big-time.
@  marchanna : (19 May 2015 - 04:38 PM) That makes good sense. Do you hope to get service parts made or custom built?
@  Mike T : (19 May 2015 - 03:07 PM) Strength in numbers....parts reproductions are more likely if we know there are 2000 or more coupes and cabriolets left...plus I have wanted to know this (how many are left) since 1977 when I first wanted to buy one.
@  marchanna : (19 May 2015 - 08:27 AM) Good stuff! Just out of curiosity, is there a practical purpose for the registry or is it just for fun?
@  Mike T : (18 May 2015 - 07:57 PM) Got some new 404s for the Registry, boo yeah!
@  marchanna : (18 May 2015 - 04:04 PM) Sup?
@  marchanna : (15 May 2015 - 04:06 AM) Haha. I just watched that skit last night.
@  FlossyTheSmart : (14 May 2015 - 05:59 AM) It's merely pining for the fjords right now
@  jwight : (14 May 2015 - 01:01 AM) That's too bad - hate to see the Mystery Run die out.
@  FlossyTheSmart : (13 May 2015 - 09:48 AM) I hadn't planned on organizing it this year. Noah had been planning on doing something I think, but he's no longer involved
@  marchanna : (12 May 2015 - 12:50 PM) Nope. It's a mystery.
@  stickman007 : (12 May 2015 - 09:41 AM) Any news on Mystery Run this year?
@  marchanna : (11 May 2015 - 02:07 PM) Nope. I had to tell the dealer I was having problems with it.
@  Francesco : (11 May 2015 - 06:03 AM) With a Star machine? Really? I find even just plugging/unplugging my ScanGauge stores CAN faults that the Star picks up.
@  marchanna : (11 May 2015 - 05:52 AM) On my ML320 I had a bad sensor and it didn't store any codes.
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 03:00 PM) i will investigate the lateral G sensor showing positive lateral acceleration while the car is at rest.
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 02:59 PM) Lights are working, alignment is correct. I'm still cycling through a variety of tire pressure combinations but the effect should still not be this aggressive considering it was flawless on bald rear tires last year. Faulty speed sensor should store a code, none stored.
@  marchanna : (10 May 2015 - 01:50 PM) Check for never tire wear with a depth gage, and tire pressure. Also if you have a bad speed sensor, it can cause an error intermittently. A slight misalignment in the front end can cause this too - i.e. improper toe-in. Other things that can affect it is a short or a ground fault in the brake and turn signal lights.
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 01:18 PM) Wheel speeds are reporting fine, the problem is around bends with specific lateral forces. On one ramp the ESP reacts aggressively on initial turn in, then after the apex I'm able to power out with full pedal.
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 01:16 PM) New last June, and painted with POR-15.
@  David_18 : (10 May 2015 - 11:46 AM) How are your ABS Ring ?
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 07:44 AM) And the same tires last summer with zero problems, only difference this year is new ones in the rear
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 07:43 AM) Yes
@  David_18 : (10 May 2015 - 07:43 AM) have*
@  David_18 : (10 May 2015 - 07:42 AM) You 4 tire with the same size ?
@  Francesco : (10 May 2015 - 07:38 AM) Yokohama S.drive 195/40-16
@  David_18 : (10 May 2015 - 07:13 AM) Brand/model ?
@  David_18 : (10 May 2015 - 07:08 AM) What tire you have ?
@  cadillacman : (10 May 2015 - 04:16 AM) try measuring the 'actual' circumference of all 4 tires, to see how much variance there is
@  Francesco : (09 May 2015 - 10:50 PM) Well I'm scratching my head. Think it might be the G sensor?
@  marchanna : (09 May 2015 - 06:44 PM) like in a PLC
@  marchanna : (09 May 2015 - 06:43 PM) I would say neither. It should have a fixed ladder logic.
@  Francesco : (09 May 2015 - 08:18 AM) Is the ESP system self-teaching or self-adapting?
@  marchanna : (08 May 2015 - 08:02 AM) Aren't they a division of Monarch Oil?
@  Mike T : (07 May 2015 - 09:11 PM) fuchs

Photo

ESP Light On and Off (on my 450)


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17 replies to this topic

#1 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 04:47 PM

My ESP warning light came on steady this morning after I accelerated from a traffic light, slight incline, wet roads. It felt like the tires may have spun a bit on acceleration. I pulled over a half a block later and turned off the ignition, waited a few seconds, then did an unlock (as if to clear the immobilizer-not sure if that would help...). Car started, light was not on. I drove to work for 45 minutes, no events. I started the car to return home and the ESP light was on again. I tried the same reset twice on my drive home but the light remained on. I got into my garage, and tried another reset, but this time, I waited a minute before I did an unlock. After about 30 secs I heard a relay click (from the SAM) and then I did the unlock and started it with no light.I realize that the ESP should come on and flash when activated, is this steady light just a hiccup? Any thoughts or experiences with same problem?Thanks!Rod
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#2 bilgladstone

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:08 PM

Dirty or rusty reluctor rings? Begin by reading through THIS THREAD HTH, Bil :sun:
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#3 Mike T

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:13 PM

It's not normal.....hard to say what it is. If it was wet up there today, it could be the brake light switch is shorting out. Next time the ESP light is on, check if the brake lights work.

2006 smart BRABUS Canada 1 cabriolet, FlyingTiger map 380023_5.png
2013 Ford Fiesta SE 5 speed, 203A and Winter packages 542252_5.png
2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200 5 speed, other goodies 206221_5.png
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#4 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:28 PM

I checked the reluctor rings a couple of weeks ago. I bit of minor surface corrosion, but otherwise, look fine. Maybe they are dirty or some wet leaves go jammed in there...if possible. I will check this and the brake lights next time this happens. BTW, no fault codes on the ScanGauge, no associated ABS or Brake lights. Thanks Gents.
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#5 Mike T

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:42 PM

The ScanGauge only reads engine faults, not any other type of faults (transmission for example).My money is on the brake light switch as the culprit.

2006 smart BRABUS Canada 1 cabriolet, FlyingTiger map 380023_5.png
2013 Ford Fiesta SE 5 speed, 203A and Winter packages 542252_5.png
2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200 5 speed, other goodies 206221_5.png
1966 Peugeot 404 Coupé Injection, in restoration (2016) 201066_5.png


#6 Francesco

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:48 PM

ESP faults won't log in the OBD, but rather on the CAN Bus. It can be pulled up by a Star Diagnostic computer.But you say you have a ScanGauge. Sometimes the OBD connector or the RJ-45 on the SG cable can cause trouble; make sure they are fully seated. I had this issue a while ago.

Francesco

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#7 Duck

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 05:50 PM

If the steering wheel angle sensor goes out of alignment too it will throw a fault. I had this issue after I hit a pretty big pothole, it was enough to throw something out of whack in the alignment and the ESP fritzed out. Once I had the car's steering re-aligned, they recalibrated the angle sensor and it was all good.(ESP factors in the angle of the steering wheel to figure out the angular velocity difference between the inside and outside wheels)-Iain
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#8 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 06:02 PM

Great pointers guys :D Thank you! I just tried it in the garage and everything is normal...will see how long this lasts.

Edited by campbellriverpassion, 13 October 2009 - 06:03 PM.

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#9 ETHICAL BEEF

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 06:13 PM

My 450 did nearly the same thing in August 09 Failed @ 67,000 km's and I've only driven it through one winter (Bought used @ 21,000 k)First the ESP light came on. Then it was a combination of ESP and ABS warning lights.They wouldn't come on until over 50 KPH.I drove this way for a few weeks and then the engine light came on.Scan Gauge showed a PO-500 ABS Brake FailureCalled Harald @ Parts4smarts and got two new reluctor rings and did a DIY ring change.I had previously cleaned the reluctor rings with emery cloth and couldn't see the cracks...they don't have to be very BIG to send it all whacko!A cracked ring would be my first choice. Both the rings in this "pic" are cracked ...one is obvious the other is not!E.B.

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  • Smart_Reluctor_ring_replace_015.jpg

Edited by ETHICAL BEEF, 13 October 2009 - 06:21 PM.


#10 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 13 October 2009 - 06:40 PM

Thanks E.B. I will have to order a set of rings just in case. My car only has 25,000 kms and it's lived on the "Wet" Coast. From the thread from Bil above, seems like you will see both ABS and ESP lights on when the rings are corroded/cracked. Strange that I am not getting the ABS light. Also, nothing normal occurred up to 90 km/hr. Maybe steering wheel angle position sensor as Iain suggests.
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#11 robm

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 02:07 AM

Thanks E.B. I will have to order a set of rings just in case. My car only has 25,000 kms and it's lived on the "Wet" Coast. From the thread from Bil above, seems like you will see both ABS and ESP lights on when the rings are corroded/cracked. Strange that I am not getting the ABS light. Also, nothing normal occurred up to 90 km/hr. Maybe steering wheel angle position sensor as Iain suggests.

I thought the problem with mine was the rings as well but MB said no. they only fixed the elect box under warrenty. Make sure you have that work carried out.
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#12 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 06:53 AM

What was wrong with the electrical box (SAM)? What did they replace/fix?
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#13 robm

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 08:23 AM

What was wrong with the electrical box (SAM)? What did they replace/fix?

the warrenty work is to move it to help keep it dry. Not sure if they did any further work - I did not get charged for additional work. We will see if I have the same problem this winter - I hope not because this car without ESP you need to be careful.
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#14 fast316

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 02:26 PM

There have been a couple recalls in regards to water getting at the stop lamp switch. Check and make sure all thsoe have been performed. I'd suspect the stop lamp switch.

#15 Mike T

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 03:35 PM

the warranty work is to move it to help keep it dry. Not sure if they did any further work - I did not get charged for additional work. We will see if I have the same problem this winter - I hope not because this car without ESP you need to be careful.

I am certain that was not the SAM that was moved. That would be one hell of a job. It would be the "Canada" electrical box that used to reside in the battery well that was moved, and it does control the brake lights so a fault there could explain this problem.

2006 smart BRABUS Canada 1 cabriolet, FlyingTiger map 380023_5.png
2013 Ford Fiesta SE 5 speed, 203A and Winter packages 542252_5.png
2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200 5 speed, other goodies 206221_5.png
1966 Peugeot 404 Coupé Injection, in restoration (2016) 201066_5.png


#16 campbellriverpassion

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 04:14 PM

I am certain that was not the SAM that was moved. That would be one hell of a job. It would be the "Canada" electrical box that used to reside in the battery well that was moved, and it does control the brake lights so a fault there could explain this problem.

Mike, where did they move the electrical box to? What is housed in there specific to the brake light system? Relay? Apparently, the brake switch has two sets of contacts, one for the lights, the other for the ECU. So it is possible that the brake lights work with one set of good contacts with the other set faulty. Gosh, I wish I had a wiring diagram for all systems on this car! From Evilution: http://www.evilution...ndex.php?id=663
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#17 robm

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 05:53 PM

I am certain that was not the SAM that was moved. That would be one hell of a job. It would be the "Canada" electrical box that used to reside in the battery well that was moved, and it does control the brake lights so a fault there could explain this problem.

that is right. I am hoping that fixed my "ABS/ESP lights" on issue. it has been fine since MB Markham did that recall/warrenty work but we will see this winter.
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#18 Mike T

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Posted 14 October 2009 - 07:24 PM

The Canada box is relocated to the toebaord at the front of the tridion above/behind the foam block.

2006 smart BRABUS Canada 1 cabriolet, FlyingTiger map 380023_5.png
2013 Ford Fiesta SE 5 speed, 203A and Winter packages 542252_5.png
2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200 5 speed, other goodies 206221_5.png
1966 Peugeot 404 Coupé Injection, in restoration (2016) 201066_5.png





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