starter removal

[Sydney]

Hi, I am new to this forum and a new smart car owner.

I just picked up a 2006 diesel smart fortwo.

it turns over really slow,  the alternator is seized so I just removed the belt the try to get it going,  but no luck.

I am thinking it must be the starter  (but I cant find it)  .

is there any easy way to get at the starter?  I would like to remove it and get it checked.

[smartdriver]

Just curious if you have measured your battery voltage with respect to ground while cranking.The battery ground connection can corrode.

 

It is also my understanding that there is an engine ground cable which can corrode.

 

I recently repaired my seized alternator and the slow turning engine immediately returned to normal speed. What leads you to believe that your alternator was seized?

 

If your alternator were seized and you removed the belt, the car should turn over quickly.

 

Does your car have air conditioning? I'm sorry for asking but there are two belts if you have air conditioning. I don't know whether the air conditioning compressor can seize.

Edited September 10, 2018 by smartdriver

[smart142]

1 hour ago, Sydney said:

I am thinking it must be the starter  (but I cant find it)  .

is there any easy way to get at the starter?  I would like to remove it and get it checked.

 

No easy way to get at the starter unfortunately.

Lots of pics in this thread to show location....http://clubsmartcar.com/index.php?/topic/31119-will-not-crank/&page=1

 

[Sydney]

47 minutes ago, smartdriver said:

Just curious if you have measured your battery voltage with respect to ground while cranking.The battery ground connection can corrode.

 

It is also my understanding that there is an engine ground cable which can corrode.

 

I recently repaired my seized alternator and the slow turning engine immediately returned to normal speed. What leads you to believe that your alternator was seized?

 

If your alternator were seized and you removed the belt, the car should turn over quickly.

 

Does your car have air conditioning? I'm sorry for asking but there are two belts if you have air conditioning. I don't know whether the air conditioning compressor can seize.

I removed both belts. (a/c & alt.). The alt was seized, I was hoping the engine would be back to normal but no luck. I have a new fully charged battery and perfect ground to chassis and earth ground to engine. (fyi the earth ground gets hot while cranking. The engine does turn over but really slow, that's why I figure it's the starter.   

 

[tolsen]

Suggest you connect jump leads from battery to engine or transmission to see if there is a ground issue.

Earth ground from chassis to transmission is usually the cause.  

You can free alternator by applying lots of penetration oil and good elbow grease. 

Only crank in short bursts. Allow starter to cool down or it can burn out. 

[tolsen]

Rear subframe must be lowered to replace starter.  It is held on with two bolts that only are accessible once intercooler support cradle is removed or lifted (held on with two M6 Torx bolts).

Lowering subframe is quick and easy but hand brake lever must be in off position and various cables, inlet duct before airbox, brake lines, etc must be unclipped to provide sufficient slack.  You also need the special Smart lowering bolts.  These are long bolts (M12x1.5)  that fit into each of the four locations where subframe bolts fit.  The lowering bolts guide the subframe both when lowering and raising.

 

An alternative is to use the longer rear subframe bolts in forward holes.  Of course rear of Smart must be on axle stands and you need a trolley jack that you can trust.  Use suitable wooden sticks to support rear end if using this method just as a precaution.

 

There are good guides both on Evilution and on FQ101.

[Sydney]

4 hours ago, tolsen said:

Rear subframe must be lowered to replace starter.  It is held on with two bolts that only are accessible once intercooler support cradle is removed or lifted (held on with two M6 Torx bolts).

Lowering subframe is quick and easy but hand brake lever must be in off position and various cables, inlet duct before airbox, brake lines, etc must be unclipped to provide sufficient slack.  You also need the special Smart lowering bolts.  These are long bolts (M12x1.5)  that fit into each of the four locations where subframe bolts fit.  The lowering bolts guide the subframe both when lowering and raising.

 

An alternative is to use the longer rear subframe bolts in forward holes.  Of course rear of Smart must be on axle stands and you need a trolley jack that you can trust.  Use suitable wooden sticks to support rear end if using this method just as a precaution.

 

There are good guides both on Evilution and on FQ101.

i dont want to upset the apple cart,  but what about cutting an access hatch thru the firewall?

i bought this smart  (as is,where is) so im not sure what other issues it might have.

i would just like to see if i can get it started before i try to get it back on the road.

[tolsen]

And cut cables and pipes plus risk setting fire to your Smart.

Unsmart in my humble opinion. 

[Sydney]

8 minutes ago, tolsen said:

And cut cables and pipes plus risk setting fire to your Smart.

Unsmart in my humble opinion. 

ok, thanks.   i will try to lower the subframe and see what happens.

would here be any other things i should look out for why doing this?  

[LooseLugNuts]

previous owner of mine cut an access hole

 

i also dont recommend it 

 

 

i welded the pieces back in and sealed it