Starts and no power to move

[RogerS 0]

New to this forum so maybe this has been covered before.  Problem started when my 05 diesel fourtwo stopped while driving. It was starting and stopped in a few seconds. It now starts but no power to drive more than a few feet on flat surface.  I have changed fuel filter, air filter, oil and filter. Cleaned air intake including EGR and turbo. Replaced fuel pressure sensor and pressure control valve. Cleaned injectors and even the muffler.  It runs rough or surges, will idle but, will die when trying to move. Had a P0251 engine light, so have bad fuel mix but at a loss as to what more to do (reset the engine light and it did not come back on).  Hope someone can help.

 

RogerS

[tolsen 630]

As far as I know there is no such fault code for our 450. 

 

I suspect you have the usual problem with burnt out terminal powering low pressure pump. 

Can you hear low pressure pump running when you turn ignition on?

[RogerS 0]

Yes, the low pressure pump works fine, I even drained the tank with it to eliminate possibility of contamination.  The high pressure pump puts out more than 5000 psi (highest my gauge goes) .

Sorry, did not clean the turbo, but everything else.  When it first quit I was driving on the open highway. It quit going up a hill, would start but banged like a clutch trying to grab.  Someone suggested a vacuum line, any ideas on this and thanks so very much for taking time to help me.  The P0251 code makes sense with the black smoke but you are probably right.

[RogerS 0]

Does anyone know if it could it simply be a dirty turbo?

[tolsen 630]

I ran mine for about 3 weeks without a turbo. Engine was gutless and max speed on the flat no more than 70 km/h. Engine idled just like before but very poor performance.

Black smoke could be stuck open EGR valve. Get yours blanked off ASAP. 0.6 mm thick stainless steel blanking piece is enough provided it is supported by the existing flange on EGR pipe at connection to EGR valve. 

Never use a pressure gauge to check common rail pressure. Read live data using a diagnostics unit. 

 

[tolsen 630]

The high pressure pump in our 450 Cdi does not have metering control hence P0251 is meaningless. 

[RogerS 0]

Thanks guys, at the minimum I am getting a good education.  Just ran it again this morning, it starts good, then dies two or or three times and then will idle when it warms a bit. I can get the revs up now but still no power to move more than a few feet.  Today I got an engine code of P0302 which I believe is a msfire on cylinder two.  If I swap two of the injectors will that tell me if it is one of the injectors? Still lots of black smoke.  I did replace both the pressure valve and the sensor with new ones.  You suggest Sudden incapacitation of 2 injectors, and while that would do it, is it likely that two would go at once?  This all started with catastrophic failure while driving on the highway.

 

Roger

[tolsen 630]

I would not touch any of the injectors. Perhaps try injector cleaner. Check common rail pressure with diagnostics. Ensure EGR is blanked off. Measure feed pump pressure with pressure gauge. Should be about 2.5 bar. Perhaps remove valve cover to confirm all is ok there. 

[RogerS 0]

Thanks for your patience with this back yard mechanic.  I will have to get it to a shop for the pressure with diagnostics.  I have cleaned the injectors and the spray pattern is excellent and they appear fine but I did not test the electrical component.  I regularly use Lucas injector cleaner in the diesel. When you say to blank off the EGR, do you mean make a blank from, say, aluminum flashing, and block the recirculating exhaust line  (the small hole in this picture)?

 

Thanks Tolsen

[RogerS 0]

Quote

Bought a backhoe

The cost of repairs is more than the car is worth, seems every part is a $1000.00.  Cheaper to bury it in the backyard.

[tolsen 630]

Blank off EGR supply as already stated using minimum 0.6 mm stainless steel plate. Aluminium flashing won’t last very long. 

[Leadwing 565]

On ‎27‎/‎09‎/‎2017 at 5:56 PM, RogerS said:

. It quit going up a hill, would start but banged like a clutch trying to grab. 

I had this happen a few months ago.  It turned out to be the clutch actuator.  ( It was fine once you could get it moving, but from a stand-still, trying to accelerate, it would bang "like a clutch trying to grab" and either stall or do a jack-rabbit start, making all sorts of horrible noises in the process )

 

[RogerS 0]

OK, got the EGR blanked off.  It seems to idle a bit better and the RPMs increase a little smoother but, always a but, at about 2000 RPM it dies.  Repeated this several times,  It starts ok but dies at 2000 RPM.  I do not really understand the comments on the clutch actuator, but am intrigued.  Is it possible that the problems I am having are related to the actuator? There is a strange  clunk or bang that I have not been able to identify.  Really do not want to fire up the backhoe so any ideas are appreciated.

 

Thanks for your patience guys

[tolsen 630]

Clunk and bang is worrying. Perhaps remove rocker cover to confirm all is well there. Check cylinder compression too. 

Edited October 20, 2017 by tolsen
Bloody iPhone auto correction.

[RogerS 0]

Before this happened the car was running perfectly, there was no faltering or power loss or any indication whatsoever. It has about a 100,000 km on it. With the right lighting it is easy to see the spray pattern, no problem there.  Prior to this (occurred in BC in May), we were running around Arizona all winter with no problems.  There are no dealers or mechanics that know of Smart Cars within 300 km of here.  I have a mechanic that has rebuilt many vehicles over the years but has not worked on a Smart Car before, but he is very good.  Unfortunately we do not have all the testing equipment that may be necessary. It is not a perfect idle but does idle, when it dies at 2000 RPM it is in neural, up on blocks. The EGR valve moves freely, tried blanking it but little change. Intake has been cleaned. Removed the fan on the air cooler as it never worked from day one and does not seem necessary.  We believe the fuel pumps are both good and the fuel and air filters were replaced.

 

Roger

[RogerS 0]

I wish I could make a video but that is beyond me.

At a total loss, it ides, can get it move, but barely.  In reverse it moves a few feet then bucks and dies.

I need a smart car so tomorrow I will buy another one and hope someone, or something comes along to solve my dilemma.

[RogerS 0]

Still need help or suggestions

I did buy another Smart Car but have not given up on the other one.

I replaced the clutch actuator and now can get the rpm up easily to 3000 or more but still no power to move.

But I need an explanation of what is happening with the air intake.  I replaced the air filter and have started the car a few times but there is much less than an hour running with the new air filter and the new filter is completely carbon black.  Does annyone have any ideas as to what would cause this blowback to blacken the filter to fast?

 

Thanks

Roger

[tolsen 630]

EGR valve stuck open or excessive amount of coal dust in air. 

[RogerS 0]

Thanks Tolsen.

I was sure it was a problem with the EGR but it happened so fast that it defies logic.  I was wondering if there is a further problem such as a partially blocked turbo. If all was good except the EGR I would not expect so much, if any blowback.

 

Your thoughts please

 

Roger